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Has CAFE reached the end of its usefulness?

507 messages,  Last post on Oct 27, 2009 at 11:49 AM

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What is this discussion about? Fuel Efficiency (MPG)


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#51 of 507
Re: tpe [nippononly] by tpe
May 19, 2006 (8:46 am)
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Replying to: nippononly (May 19, 2006 6:57 am)

Here in California, election season has heated up in the TV ads with two candidates battling it out over increasing gas taxes to combat this problem, which one candidate advocates and the other opposes.
 
That's interesting that a candidate actually has the balls to suggest increasing the gas tax. Throughout the rest of the country most politicians are suggesting that the gas tax be reduced to provide some assistance at the pump. That is absolutely the wrong thing to do in that by lowering the price you will simply increase demand, which will in turn offset some of the savings. A state might end up forfeiting 20 cents a gallon in revenue, which might result in only providing an 18 cent reduction in gas prices. Not a very good investment. There's got to be a better way to mitigate the effects of high gas prices on the economy.
#52 of 507
Re: tpe [tpe] by gagrice
May 19, 2006 (5:32 pm)
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Replying to: tpe (May 19, 2006 8:46 am)

There's got to be a better way to mitigate the effects of high gas prices on the economy.
 
People could drive less. The roads are packed all day. I don't think anyone is at work.
#53 of 507
Re: One thing [tpe] by boaz47
May 20, 2006 (6:45 am)
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Replying to: tpe (May 04, 2006 5:39 am)

I think historical this country gives lip service to political correctness on things like the environment and conservation until we reach a economic crisis. Then political correctness falls to the wayside. The price at the pump may be discomforting and people may complain but they don't seem to care as much as they did when we thought gas was running out, like in the 70s. Because we as a culture are consumers and are willing to work to pay for what we consume even if it seems excessive to our foreign cousins. Because we have the ability and capacity to do so. Go to a dinner party and the conversation hardly ever turns to the plight of our poor european cousins paying higher fuel prices because of high taxes. If anything we as a culture believe they are foolish to not vote their leaders out, even if it is more difficult to vote them out than it might be here.
 
what we over look when we propose higher fuel taxes is higher costs on every thing we buy. Higher taxes to the average consumer makes it harder for the lower income person to survive so they often find is easier to go on welfair. A reaction very common in parts of Europe. Higher fuel taxes and fuel prices drive up the cost of food. Do we as a nation care that in Japan a Cantelope costs $38.00 each? No we only care what it cost us. De we care if they pay twice or three times what we do for beef? No we only care that we pay less.
 
There is simply no way a program like CAFE can work without lowering our life style to that of other countries and that is simply something most Americans can't support. At least that is how I see it.
#54 of 507
Re: One thing [boaz47] by gagrice
May 20, 2006 (7:03 am)
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Replying to: boaz47 (May 20, 2006 6:45 am)

The latest wrinkle in the CAFE standards will be E85. Most of the vehicles offered for E85 are at least 10 MPG under the CAFE 27.2 MPG standard. So you can buy a FFV to circumvent the CAFE rules and just run regular gas in it.
#55 of 507
Re: One thing [gagrice] by boaz47
May 21, 2006 (3:31 pm)
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Replying to: gagrice (May 20, 2006 7:03 am)

Yes, GM used to get CAFE credits for making Multi fuel vehicles. Just making them allowed them to get credits on what their bigger vehicles used. Just my opinion but that is why I believe the Japanese made a brilliant manufacturing move when they conned CARB into dropping their zero emmisions demands and settled for Hybrids. Thirty years ago CARB demanded zero emmisions vehicles from the manufacturers by the year 2000. The manufacturers countered with the suggestion that they couldn't do it in the time allotted but they could produce a Hybrid even back then. As 2000 approached GM, Ford, Toyota and even Honda were working frantically on Electric cars. GM had the EV-1, Ford had the Think and Toyota had a whole fleet of Rav4 electric cars operating in New York. Just as soon as Honda and Toyota decided to market the hybrids CARB and CAFE dropped their demand and the manufacturers dropped electric cars. Now the common thought by CAFE is that zero emmisions aren't practical and no one is pushing for it. CAFE is rule by committee and a Committee is only as smart as their dumbest member. CAFE has to have a lot of fools on it.
#56 of 507
Re: One thing [boaz47] by gagrice
May 21, 2006 (3:57 pm)
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Replying to: boaz47 (May 21, 2006 3:31 pm)

CAFE has to have a lot of fools on it
 
Amen and CARB likewise!
#57 of 507
High court to hear auto CO2 case by rockylee
Jun 27, 2006 (1:58 am)
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If Supreme Court rules EPA must regulate emissions, Big 3 would have to invest heavily in alternative fuels.
 
http://www.detroitnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060627/AUTO01/606270378/- 1148
 
Rocky
#58 of 507
Supreme Court will hear important environment case by rockylee
Jun 27, 2006 (2:05 am)
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http://www.detroitnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060626/UPDATE/606260404/- 1148/AUTO01
 
Rocky
#59 of 507
it will be interesting by nippononly
Jun 27, 2006 (7:39 am)
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to see how the Supremes rule on this thing. Either way, though, I don't think it will have much impact on fuel economy requirements for cars. Remember, the EPA is just a division of the government, and it operates under the heavy thumb of whoever is in the administration. Under Dubya, EPA has reneged on just about every duty it has for the last six years, and reversed decades of progress on protecting the environment.
 
But if the Supremes rule that EPA DOES have this authority, it will strengthen the positions of the state governments like California's (and a dozen others so far) that want to regulate CO2 emissions themselves. That's a good thing.
#60 of 507
Re: it will be interesting [nippononly] by gagrice
Jun 27, 2006 (9:46 pm)
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Replying to: nippononly (Jun 27, 2006 7:39 am)

as the primary "greenhouse" gas causing a warming of the earth, carbon dioxide is a pollutant.
 
I think the Supreme Court will side with the Appeals court. If they can control CO2 they can tell you when to breathe and when not to. It is way to basic and foolish. I am surprised they agreed to take the case. Too bad it is such a political football. If we want less CO2 open up the gates for more diesel cars. They put out less CO and CO2 per mile driven. Kyoto is a flop and even the progenitors in Japan cannot live up to their own stupid idea. Britain is waffling when Tony Blair said it was unrealistic to try and achieve.

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