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Honda Civic vs Volkswagen Jetta

498 messages,  Last post on Mar 11, 2013 at 12:20 PM

You are in the Volkswagen Jetta Forum.

What is this discussion about? Honda Civic, Volkswagen Jetta, Sedan

Messages Page 47 of 50

#459 of 498 Re: long life tires..brakes...etc [targettuning] by ruking1

Mar 12, 2007 (12:16 pm)

Replying to: targettuning (Mar 12, 2007 12:09 pm)
Scientific Wild Ass Guess. SWAG
 
First off I am a tad confused, You got 293k miles on one or several? Your follow up posts indicate several. Again, correct me if I am wrong.
 
I don't know how to say this but; alternators, starters, batteries, water pumps are sort of unscheduled, BUT scheduled maintenance items. However, anecdotally they do last however long they do last, i.e., do have a cost per cycle so to speak. If anyone is confused by this seemingly double talk, let me know. DIY folks and maintenance types do understand.
 
One of the things about 4 bangers is the timing belt change at app 100/105k. The good news, belts are more precise and obviously changed at the scheduled intervals refresh for another 100/105 mile cycle. The bad news is they stretch and can break and the design.
 
The older A-3 gen VW Jetta's put the water pump out of line. So in effect a water pump is good to go to at least 250,000 miles. BUT if it doesn't, you do not have to change the timing belt and is a simple ( less than 20 min) procedure vs a timing belt procedure of 2/6 hours. Both Honda (75 plus shipping) and A-4 gen (60 plus shipping) put the water pump in line. So even though it can be good to go to 200,000/250,000 miles it makes sense to change the water pump (early) at the 100/150 mile cycle (SAME LABOR COST). The reason is IF it does leak you have to perform the same belt change to change the water pump.

#460 of 498 Re: long life tires..brakes...etc [ruking1] by targettuning

Mar 13, 2007 (4:39 am)

Replying to: ruking1 (Mar 12, 2007 12:16 pm)
To help clear things up then...a 1987 Taurus wagon = 293K miles. a 1987 Taurus LX sedan = approx 188K miles a 1986 Sable wagon = approx 160K miles. I owned about 6 or 7 of these from the 1986 to 1989 model years but these three reached the highest mileage before disposing of/selling them. I bought them used after they were more than a couple of years old and drove the hell out of them. They fit my needs back then especially the station wagon versions. I kept the 87 wagon with 293K the longest (13 years). I never computed the cost to own any car I had but remember some were more problematic than others. When you keep a car as long as I kept some of these replacing alternators etc is inevitable. The only one that stands out was the 87 LX sedan which had an immense amount of small to medium problems mostly electrical (power window motors..power locks...climate control/AC wiring etc) it was in the shop more than any car I have ever owned however the Vulcan 3.0 V-6 ran flawlessly on all.

#461 of 498 Re: long life tires..brakes...etc [targettuning] by ruking1

Mar 13, 2007 (8:00 am)

Replying to: targettuning (Mar 13, 2007 4:39 am)
Under the category of lessons learned; truly if Honda's Civic's and VW's Jetta's are STATISTICALLY better than Ford's Taurus's, then in a manner of speaking, I have set my mileage goals WAY too low.
 
Since I have in the past run app 250,000 on a 1970 VW Beetle (bought used in 1971 with 10,000 miles, sold in 1978) and on conventional oil (1.5/3k mile OCI's). Geez every time I turned around, I was changing oil. For the oil filter super freaks, it might bear mentioning, the Beetle's air cooled engine didn't even have an oil filter! It quite literally used a stainless steel "mosquito screen". Oxymoronically the motor oil was used as an air screen, pre intake manifold.
 
I also ran a 1987 Toyota Landcruiser, 4 speed manual app 250,000 miles on Mobil One 5w30 oil with 15,000 OCI's.
 
So I think I will target 420,000 miles on the Civic (4 timing belt changes) . I will keep the same targets for the Jetta. Incidently a brand new TDI diesel engine is app $4,200.

#462 of 498 Re: long life tires..brakes...etc [ruking1] by 600kgolfgt

Mar 14, 2007 (4:13 pm)

Replying to: ruking1 (Mar 13, 2007 8:00 am)
So I think I will target 420,000 miles on the Civic (4 timing belt changes) . I will keep the same targets for the Jetta. Incidently a brand new TDI diesel engine is app $4,200.
 
Those are reasonable targets - the first engine in my 1987 Golf lasted 429,000 miles....

#463 of 498 Re: long life tires..brakes...etc [600kgolfgt] by ruking1

Mar 14, 2007 (4:23 pm)

Replying to: 600kgolfgt (Mar 14, 2007 4:13 pm)
Ops, I probably should have clarified the targets for the Jetta, min of 5 belt changes, (500,000 miles) and more if possible. Again the design life for a TDI ALH engine is 25,000 miles (80% loading) As most folks know the good news and bad news is normal freeway speeds or an AVERAGE of 40-55 mph is probably no more that a 20-30% loading. So for me that puts the targets at the upper end of 1,000,000 to 1,250,000. So at 90,000 I have a ways to go.

#464 of 498 2009 Honda Civic or VW Jetta? by BilKop

Dec 02, 2008 (9:41 am)

Hi everyone!
I'm about to buy my first car, had (in my mind) settled on a 2009 VW Jetta S, but after reading some of the posts on the VW forums, I'm not so sure.
 
Another car I was considering is a Honda Civic, but we have one (2000), and there are many little things about it that annoy me - the tiny trunk, the noisy and bumpy ride, the ridiculous horn, and we have also had a million little things break on it, most recently the A/C which would cost a fortune to replace.
 
Any advice?

#465 of 498 Re: long life tires..brakes...etc [ruking1] by ruking1

Dec 02, 2008 (10:38 am)

Replying to: ruking1 (Mar 14, 2007 4:23 pm)
..."Again the design life for a TDI ALH engine is 25,000 miles (80% loading"...
 
Change miles to HOURS.

#466 of 498 Re: 2009 Honda Civic or VW Jetta? [BilKop] by ruking1

Dec 02, 2008 (10:59 am)

Replying to: BilKop (Dec 02, 2008 9:41 am)
All cars, regardless of their reputations/marketing NEED/demand/require maintenance. Indeed your anecdotal experiences with Honda Civic really makes my case. The only question is whether maintenance is unscheduled/schedule or a combination. You of course can go to whatever web site and compare the scheduled maintenance and weigh the situation. Durability and reliability affects unscheduled maintenance. NO maintenance is an absolute myth !!!! You would be much better off if you expanded your education and do some to all; DIY and/or leave the major stuff to shops, mechanics, etc that you truly know do good work. Anymore, special tools and/or equipment and or costs can make it uneconomical for you to purchase and sometimes just rent.
 
Your comments give me a sense that either you got a lemon Civic or more likely, just fix things when they no longer work.
 
So for example, my Civic at 76,000 miles has been on the one hand EXCELLENT, but on the other hand, I have needed tires at 74,300 miles and three alignments. (we are not curb wackers). Compare this against a VW Jetta TDI that did NOT need an alignment at 100,000 miles and the oe tires are still rolling 111,000 miles. I run 20,000 /25,000 miles OCI's for the Civic/Jetta TDI respectively. At LIKE (76,000 ) mileage, while I have been satisfied with both, the Honda's consumable parts seem to wear 2 to 3 times FASTER.

#467 of 498 Re: 2009 Honda Civic or VW Jetta? [ruking1] by BilKop

Dec 02, 2008 (11:37 am)

Replying to: ruking1 (Dec 02, 2008 10:59 am)
Yes, I do realize that they need maintenance, I was more worried about having to spend tons of money on things breaking (people's examples have included faulty electrical wiring, etc.).
 
"Your comments give me a sense that either you got a lemon Civic or more likely, just fix things when they no longer work."
 
How is one supposed to fix things before they break?
 
My husband is in charge of the Honda, and he takes it for all it's maintenance appointments, but it really has been one thing after another that has been going on it (forget what the thing is called that makes it sound like a tractor (English is not my first language), but that's been a problem several times, along with other non-life threatening issues, but annoying nonetheless). On the other hand, my sister-in-law had a Honda Accord for 10 years, and nothing broke on that. She says she probably spent a total of $300 on it during all those years.
 
I am also wondering if people are more likely to post comments when they have bad experiences rather than good. I guess I'll just have to go with my gut feeling once I test drive one.

#468 of 498 Re: 2009 Honda Civic or VW Jetta? [BilKop] by ruking1

Dec 02, 2008 (12:04 pm)

Replying to: BilKop (Dec 02, 2008 11:37 am)
..."How is one supposed to fix things before they break?"...
 
While your quote might seem oxymoronic, indeed it is NOT. It is really a matter of listening, watching, etc. The car is really "talking to " you. It is really a matter of whether one choses to listen. So for example, you point out your husband is in charge of the maintenance. But indeed if he/she/it is not the primary or alternative driver, it is truly the responsibility of the primary driver (aka YOU).
 
I will give you an example, as much as I brought up my daughters to know, listen for , understand, shown and watch them actually check what is important: they would rather go to funerals, have root canal, etc. (you get the drift, I hope)
 
So one car was 300 miles/600 miles round trip AWAY, the other is currently 100/200 miles away. One made the 300 mile trip , 2 quarts LOW !!!!!!! GEEZ !! So I asked her when was the LAST time she checked the dipstick, !?? I mean if the engine burns up, its HER stuck in the middle of no where (some place in Santa Barbara/LA area) !!?? Not a good place for ANYBODY to be!!!
 
So to get back to Honda vs Jetta, the chance seems lower with the Honda in getting a lemon/to lemonish. Of course that is no consolation if you truy have THE lemon (of whatever oem).

Messages Page 47 of 50

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