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Smart Shopper Stories from the Sales Frontlines
47976 messages, Last post on Nov 29, 2009 at 11:21 AM
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Replying to: explorerx4 (Mar 01, 2008 9:18 am)  Mackabee
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Replying to: mackabee (Mar 01, 2008 6:44 pm) i have seen 2 or 3 of them. ever. what recommends one over another suv?
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I posted some of this in the BMW 5 series lease forum. However, as a former car salesman and current car customer, I wanted to share here too since I have enjoyed some of the stories here since I have experienced much of the same during my car sales days. I hope some of you find this helpful also. This forum was a great resource for me and the posts here are extremely informative. I sold cars for several years and, in hindsight, found it to be a great experience although I wouldn't want to go back to do it again. I don't really like to shop for cars especially since I sympathize with the salesmen. However, my Infiniti lease was up so I was in the market again. I have to say that I was disappointed in the salesmanship skills of some of the salesmen that I encountered. I walked a few lots to check out some cars I was interested in and minimized my interaction with salesmen when I knew I wasn't ready to purchase. I walked lots mostly during off hours or during slower times (early weekdays) to check out cars I was interested in so as not to "stroke" anyone and deny them an opportunity to help a more serious buyer during potentially busier times. I did my research mostly via Edmunds and it is an excellent resource. I did contact a few dealers by phone to get quotes and only worked with two that I felt good about. As a former salesman, I like to see someone make an effort to earn the sale with earnest interaction and rapport and who respected where I was coming from. Those are the ones I discussed price with seriously and was straightforward with them about my background and price goals. As long as I got close to my goals and the salesman did his job properly and respectfully, I didn't quibble over a couple of hundred dollars. My final deal took just 1 sit-down visit to the first dealer and a few phone calls to a couple of dealers after that. I didn't shop different BMW dealers until after I didn't make a deal with the first salesman (my fault as told below). The first salesman I didn't make a deal with because I started at some ridiculously low numbers not due to a negotiating tactic but due to miscalculation and lack of complete information on my part. I became that customer some of you may be familiar with that thought he had "all the facts", armed with facts and worksheets, but actually didn't have all the facts and calculated everything wrong. All the manager did was come out and say he couldn't do it without any further effort to learn how I came about my numbers or working with me. I went there to BUY, not shop numbers. I had to research later on my own online to find out how off base I was and appropriately readjusted my payment goals. (I forgot the acq fee that needed to be added to the gross cap cost) I have to say that of all the lots I walked or the salesmen I observed, BMW salesmen are by far the biggest pricks I encountered. Salesmen are supposed to EARN your business, not wait around for people to throw money at them. As a former salesman, I like to be sold on something. BMW salesmen, although I only interacted with a couple at length, almost universally demonstrated the worst habits of car sales. 1. "prequalifying" a prospect (big no no) by observation only. This means they looked at me, didn't consider me to be a "big fish" and ignored me. Didn't even bother with a cursory greeting. Just guys standing around talking, quick look at me, then back to their social conversation among themselves. I'm no poor schmo looking slob but I don't go out of my way to look like I earn mid-six figures a year. Gee, sorry for not having that written on my forehead for the BMW salesman to see. 2. One thing I learned in the business and from my managers is never let a hot prospect walk off the lot if could help it. These guys acted like they didn't need your business just because they represent BMW's and the cars sell themselves. In that case, BMW should get rid of the traditional car sales model entirely and go to the CarMax/Best Buy sales model. That first BMW dealership I went to could have had the sale. So why did I lease the BMW? I drove it (Point #3: Test drives work). That first salesman I tried to make a deal with was "kind" enough to give me the time of day and offer me a test drive while I was checking out different cars I was considering. The BMW is an awesome drive. Pulled me from the LS460 that I was seriously considering getting. By the way, the Lexus salespeople were universally excellent and courteous (Santa Monica Lexus). Absolutely no attitude or reduction in service even though I told them that I was just looking and didn't want to waste their time. Oh by the way, the 535i broke down tonight 4 days after I acquired it. Lost engine power halfway between San Diego and LA Saturday night. Had to be towed. Staying at Ritz Carlton Laguna Niguel courtesy of BMW (they don't know it yet but will first thing Monday). Definitely going Lexus next time... |
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Replying to: bruiseraex (Mar 02, 2008 4:42 am) Sorry to hear that BMW guys were Less than stellar. I can't say I've never pro-filed someone, but I try to avoid it, and do my job. It's tough when someone is far away from a realistic deal. Yes, it is our job to work with people. However, sometimes it's like being on 2 different planets with nothing but a bicycle for transportation. I'm glad everything worked out with your BMW, but sad to hear it broke down so soon. I guess the alternative is to by a Lexus, still break down, and be bored out of your mind with the commute. Look forward to more posts from you |
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Replying to: explorerx4 (Mar 01, 2008 7:58 pm) MACK |
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Replying to: bruiseraex (Mar 02, 2008 4:42 am) In my 10 years experience the worst customers are previous car salesman that think they know it all. Mack
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Replying to: bruiseraex (Mar 02, 2008 4:42 am) There has been a lot of discussion on this board about that kind of thing. It does seem to happen at high-line dealers more often than others. In my most recent quest for a new car the only dealer who had a notable disdain for my appearance was the Honda salesman. The nicest by far was the Pontiac SM who invited me to "waste his time" all I wanted. I went with Mitsubishi who didn't care that I was wearing jeans, a beat up old ski parka and a Timex watch. I bet the BMW store would have set the dogs on me as soon as I exited my car. 
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Replying to: oldfarmer50 (Mar 02, 2008 9:12 am)  ), or maybe borrow the rusted Geo Storm that I handed down to a friend couple of years ago  .
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Replying to: sky23213 (Mar 02, 2008 11:21 am) Perhaps you should. I can think up a number of excuses for not paying all the money for a BMW which would have me pointing to the old beater in the parking lot and saying "You see that old car out there..."
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Replying to: mackabee (Mar 02, 2008 9:07 am) I sold cars for 7 years mostly at a straight sale store and sometimes helped my managers close deals for the greenpeas when they were busy with other deals. I was taught to always defend my position (regarding price) multiple times and always ask questions to get to the root of the objection in order to overcome it. So with regards to that first salesman, I have to admit that I was a bit embarrassed by my error and I was not ashamed to admit it to him a couple of days later when he called. So why did I not go back. As I mentioned previously, while I was "in the box", the manager came by and within his 30 second visit: 1. said no can do, impossible, not reality 2. made a snide comment about me having my computer with me (yes, that's where I had my lease worksheet that an old customer gave me years ago when he worked me on a car deal - it can be found online still) 3. left without asking questions or working the numbers and then left the dealership entirely right after since his shift was off. Where I worked, we worked till the deal was DONE even if we had to stay till after midnight. The salesman gave up and in the callback didn't try to get me back in since they didn't have the car I wanted anymore and actually recommended a list of other dealers for me to go to. I ended up getting a more expensive car than I originally wanted. I ended up paying $1K over invoice which I felt was a good enough deal (I was not going to waste time grinding for a few hundred more dollars off) and still quite reasonable for any dealer. The one I bought from took the time to work the numbers with me, confirm my information or corrected it. I told him HONESTLY what I did before, admitted my error with the first dealer, what other offers I had and I expected him to be straight with me. I am not completely a payment buyer. The only reason I hemmed a bit over the payment was whether I felt that particular BMW was worth it to me or not since I am not a diehard BMW fan. I was ready to spend over $1K a month on an LS lease. All I wanted was a good deal and decent service. I wasn't going to waste time and quibble over a few hundred bucks more off. As a matter of fact, when I closed that deal with the dealer, another dealer I had emailed at the same time called in and I told them I had already committed and wasn't going to shop anymore. As a former salesman, I worked hard for what I earned and don't respect those that don't show the same work ethic. It's not my job to earn your sale, it's your job to earn my purchase.
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