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MPG Ratings Will Drop Under EPA Proposal

375 messages,  Last post on Oct 02, 2008 at 9:08 PM

You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires

What is this discussion about? Fuel Efficiency (MPG)

See this Edmunds.com article! EPA Overhauls Fuel Economy Estimates for 2008 - As the 2008 model-year cars hit the lot, shoppers will notice a big difference — the EPA has changed its fuel economy testing methods to produce mileage estimates that reflect "real world" driving habits. - (more)


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#5 of 375
. by sls002
Jan 11, 2006 (9:39 am)
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The EPA should conduct real test of fuel consumption instead of making it a part of the emmissions tests. A useful result would be to have a steady state fuel consumption at say 45 MPH, 60 MPH and 75 MPH so that one could see how well a vehicle would do on real world highways. Stop and go driving is a real mess. A cold engine will burn more fuel than a warm engine, so a 2 mile drive to work will result in a much worse comsumption rate than a 10 mile drive to work.
#6 of 375
they estimate by nippononly
Jan 11, 2006 (3:50 pm)
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that the ratings will drop around 20%. They are going to start using the A/C during the test, and will also drive them real highway speeds (probably 65, I would guess).
 
It will be a good thing. Right now they are kind of pie in the sky for many folks (although I personally always achieve mileage somewhere in between the two ratings).
#7 of 375
Much worse for hybrids. [nippononly] by scott1256
Jan 11, 2006 (4:04 pm)
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Replying to: nippononly (Jan 11, 2006 3:50 pm)

From Autoextremist today: mileage estimated to drop 5-20% on most cars.
 
Hybrids will fall much more: 20-30%. This will be a hit for the hybrid market but may be more realistic.
 
http://www.autoextremist.com/page6.shtml
 
Page down a litte to the paragraph about mileage.
#8 of 375
Re: they estimate [nippononly] by carlisimo
Jan 11, 2006 (4:09 pm)
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Replying to: nippononly (Jan 11, 2006 3:50 pm)

"and will also drive them real highway speeds (probably 65, I would guess)."
 
hah!
 
As for hybrids, the new numbers may reduce showroom traffic, but they'll also reduce complaints by owners. Dealers have complained that they're legally not allowed to give realistic mileage numbers because you have to display the EPA figures.
 
There could also be an effect on tall-geared engines like the Corvette (is "tall" correct?), which will suffer a greater change (proportionately) in revs at the more realistic highway speeds.
#9 of 375
Re: they estimate [carlisimo] by explorerx4
Jan 11, 2006 (5:52 pm)
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Replying to: carlisimo (Jan 11, 2006 4:09 pm)

i disagree about the corvette. real world highway mileage is very good. the engine will work better at 65 mph than the 55 or whatever the epa test uses. the corvette trick (1 to 4 shift) is to help the city mileage rating. to be honest, i don't know if it still uses that.
#10 of 375
Re: they estimate [explorerx4] by carlisimo
Jan 11, 2006 (6:04 pm)
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Replying to: explorerx4 (Jan 11, 2006 5:52 pm)

I think the EPA uses a 60mph maximum, with an average speed in the 40s (!). That means a lot of economy cars are forced to shift into a lower gear for some of the test, which puts them at a disadvantage compared to big engined cars (if I'm right about the current test). That was my line of reasoning, but real world info matters more. But if Corvette owners are getting their rated mileage, they really need to find some funner roads...
#11 of 375
Re: they estimate [carlisimo] by starrow68
Jan 12, 2006 (12:09 pm)
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Replying to: carlisimo (Jan 11, 2006 6:04 pm)

Some cars, like the Corvette, have been tailored to the test to get a great result (no gas guzzler tax at 400hp or even 505hp), and that has resulted in some drivers getting very good real world results. However, the variation in milage for Corvette drivers is very wide since some don't like to get into 6th except for very high speeds while I'll use it on any flat road over about 40mph. Others like to listen to the exhaust note and stay in 4th and don't even get to 5th much. Don't have any experience in the older 4 speed autos. The new 6sp auto should be good news for mileage. At about 45mph on a flat road my instant mileage readout is at about 35mpg in 6th gear. Of course there are places you have to stop and idle in the real world, hence I average in the low 20's, while the wife who drives much more conservatively on take off than I do, averages in the upper teens, go figure.
Randy
#12 of 375
CAFE? by robertsmx
Jan 12, 2006 (12:20 pm)
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Does it follow suit, or sticks to its current standard?
#13 of 375
Re: they estimate [nippononly] by sls002
Jan 12, 2006 (1:16 pm)
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Replying to: nippononly (Jan 11, 2006 3:50 pm)

On long highway trips with my Seville I can average around 29 MPG by taking it easy. This is well over the highway rating. For local driving I average more than the city rating but less than the highway rating. Everyday driving is not something that the EPA tests can predict for anyone unless they happen to drive exactly like the test.
#14 of 375
Re: they estimate [carlisimo] by nippononly
Jan 12, 2006 (2:10 pm)
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Replying to: carlisimo (Jan 11, 2006 6:04 pm)

Doesn't the EPA max out at like 52 mph on the highway test? I think the most significant thing is probably that they will use the A/C during the test now.
 
The place where cars like the Corvette will suffer is the city test, not the highway test. They are going to shorten the cycling from cold for that portion, I believe. So instead of 1 10-mile drive with 40-some stops (or whatever the exact test is - I know it is something like that), they will do something more like 1 5-mile drive with 20 stops and 2 2.5-mile drives with 10 stops. With the engine getting cold in between.
 
robertsmx: CAFE stays the same. BUA-HA-HA-HA! That is going to hit the domestics a lot harder than the rest, I think, but we will see. The hybrids obviously will drop a TON in rating - I wonder how that will affect sales. They will probably still do significantly better than gas-only counterparts.

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