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Automotive News & Views What is "wrong" with these new subcompacts?
8656 messages, Last post on Nov 29, 2009 at 3:06 PM
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Replying to: thegraduate (Dec 07, 2007 12:02 pm) Well basically, buy what you're comfortable with. If you're getting that kind of economy in an Accord, it's doubtful you'll do much better with a smaller car (MPG-wise yes, but $ wise, probably not, unless you drive an incredible amount of miles). Still, there are tradeoffs. The Accord is bigger, roomier, more comfortable. Probably quieter and smoother riding. The Lancer might be more nimble, easier to park in tight spaces, give a more connected driving experience, etc. I've sort of run into a similar situation with my cars. My 2000 Intrepid a "fullsize" (according to the EPA at least...I'm still a bit old fashioned and call it a roomy intermediate  ) can break 30 mpg if leisurely driven on the highway. Best I ever did was around 31. I've driven my uncle's '03 Corolla a few times, and one time keeping track of mileage I got around 37.4, driven fairly leisurely, highway driving...actually, the same run where I got 31 with the Intrepid! The up-side of the Corolla was the 20% improvement in fuel economy. Sounds impressive, doesn't it? However, on that 230 mile trip I took, that translates to a gallonage of 6.15 for the Corolla, 7.42 for the Intrepid. A difference of 1.27 gallons. At $3.00 per gallon, that comes out to a savings of like $3.81 over the course of that trip. All of a sudden, not so great. Now, if the Corolla is your thing, more power to you. However, I find it cramped, noisy, rough riding, uncomfortable, worse-handling, and slower-accelerating than my Intrepid. I also rarely have to worry about squeezing into tight parking spaces, so that advantage is pretty much a moot point for me. I'm used to driving pickup trucks and 221" long Chryslers, so to me the Intrepid IS a small, nimble car!  However, to someone else, who doesn't really need something Intrepid-sized, and is comfortable with the Corolla, then they should go for it. It's a perfectly adequate car, but it just doesn't fit ME. So in short, buy what fits you the best, and what you're most comfortable with. If I had to go out and buy a new car right now, I'd probably get a 4-cyl Altima. It's smaller than my Intrepid, but still big enough to for me to fit in comfortably. According to the EPA, it should get better fuel economy. Basically, it's not too big, not too small, fairly economical, and fast enough for my needs.
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Replying to: iluvmysephia1 (Dec 07, 2007 12:12 pm) Who is to say that subcompact buyers don't do the same thing? Just because you like and dislike certain vehicle designs doesn't mean that other people don't feel the opposite. I couldn't put up with the interior quality of the Lancer, personally. That alone would cause me to look at other vehicles. The power/economy tradeoff was pretty bad in a brand new model as well. My point that I'm trying to make, in a roundabout fashion, is this. The reasons you have for choosing a larger/different car may be just the reasons other people CHOOSE a compact. And, every subcompact I know delivers compared to the 21/29 MPG the Lancer is estimated to get in standardized conditions. Versa - 27/33 MPG, more room (EPA Midsize I believe), extra cargo capacity with hatchback option. Fit - 27/34, LOADS of cargo space with magic seats, GREAT handling Yaris - 29/35, the Yaris gets in city stop and go what the Lancer gets on the highway! You say the Lancer is a better deal all the way around... well, for YOU it is. You seem to be losing sight of the fact that we all have different needs. Some want great economy and loads of practicality. Some want midsize room and subcompact fuel economy. Some want the most fun-to-drive at the lowest cost. The Lancer doesn't deliever on any of these wants I've listed, and therefore wouldn't be the best all around deal. It's great that you love your Lancer, it was obviously the best car for you. It's obviously not for everyone, because I never see them on the roads (that's good if you want a unique vehicle).
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Replying to: andre1969 (Dec 07, 2007 12:32 pm) Now, if the Corolla is your thing, more power to you. However, I find it cramped, noisy, rough riding, uncomfortable, worse-handling, and slower-accelerating than my Intrepid. I also rarely have to worry about squeezing into tight parking spaces, so that advantage is pretty much a moot point for me. I'm used to driving pickup trucks and 221" long Chryslers, so to me the Intrepid IS a small, nimble car! However, to someone else, who doesn't really need something Intrepid-sized, and is comfortable with the Corolla, then they should go for it. It's a perfectly adequate car, but it just doesn't fit ME. So in short, buy what fits you the best, and what you're most comfortable with. If I had to go out and buy a new car right now, I'd probably get a 4-cyl Altima. It's smaller than my Intrepid, but still big enough to for me to fit in comfortably. According to the EPA, it should get better fuel economy. Basically, it's not too big, not too small, fairly economical, and fast enough for my needs. I agree with everything you've said. Buy what's best for you. Just don't ridicule other purchaser's decisions because they don't fit what you would do - they have different needs and wants. If they didn't we'd probably all be in a Camry.  And, andre, my ex-gf had a 2004 Corolla; definitely not the best car in the world for fitting tall guys behind the wheel (I'm 6'4" and the driving position was HORRIBLE). I too like the new Altima, but that's a topic for another board. )
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Replying to: thegraduate (Dec 07, 2007 12:32 pm) Fit - 27/34, LOADS of cargo space with magic seats, GREAT handling Yaris - 29/35, the Yaris gets in city stop and go what the Lancer gets on the highway! Can we please add the Scion xD in here because it is basically the 5 door Yaris that is sold overseas with a different body style. It's also roomy and the seats are more comfortable than the Fit and the Versa at least for me. The Figures Scion xD - 27/33 so the same as the Versa. The xD has a Corolla engine in it which is very reliable as well.
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Replying to: tiff_c (Dec 07, 2007 12:39 pm)
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Replying to: iluvmysephia1 (Dec 07, 2007 12:12 pm) Personally, I don't understand why so many people are so concerned about vehicle comfort. Granted, some people have long commutes, but most of us spend very little time in a car relative to everything else we do. Conversely I never hear people complain about how uncomfortable their chair at work is. I actually think my Prizm is comfortable (6 ft+ 200 lbs) but it is just a tool which gets me to and from work. I value the economy, low maintenance costs and ease of parking. Cars are bad places to stick your money anyway, so it never made much sense to me to stick anymore money into it than I have to. I actually chose it because it had a MT, no PW and no PL. Of course these are just my feelings, but as much as I like cars I have never become accustomed to how strongly people feel about their vehicles and how many creature comforts they expect. 
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Replying to: thegraduate (Dec 07, 2007 12:35 pm) See, I could never go out with a girl with a Corolla in the first place. 
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Replying to: lilengineerboy (Dec 07, 2007 12:52 pm)  (Mom had a Lexus GX470 and dad drove an assortment of Audi's since he was a GSM at a local Porsche-Audi dealer). |
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Replying to: Mr_Shiftright (Dec 07, 2007 8:28 am) Using the logic that if we all only got just what we needed then a person that switched to a Fit, Edmunds rates the base Fit at 28-34, from a base Corolla, rated by Edmunds at 28-37 will be wasting 3 MPG uselessly. Obviously you don't need a smaller car getting less fuel mileage. So if we only got just what we needed we could all drive Corollas. In fact a Fit driver would seem like a gas guzzler to a Yaris driver. If you are getting 34-40 MPG in a Yaris how do you justify giving up 4 to 6 mpg out of want rather than need? Not only that you tossed more money out the door because the Fit costs more. Even the Smart doesn't list their fuel mileage higher than a Yaris on their web site. So all we all need is a Yaris, and really dark glasses so we can't see each other. If someone has the money to spend on a Hummer it is their money, they worked for it, in most cases, and if they want to give it away it isn't our task to suggest that we have a better use for it. It is no different than getting a 911 or a Z06. It is no different than buying a power boat. You and I both know that a Viper is a fuel miser compared to 2 Yamaha 200 HP outboard let alone 4 Volvo Pentas. But even in that industry there are those who will toss their money out on a $300,000.00 sail boat and complain about how much fuel the 150K speed boat uses. Maybe the best choice is what someone said in the forum on what your car says about you. I don't car all that much what someone else drives. And I don't care that much about what someone else thinks about what I should drive. Looking at the number one selling vehicle in the US I would say that is a majority opinion. |
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Replying to: boaz47 (Dec 07, 2007 12:56 pm) I think that is the issue he is getting at. His argument is that you are only thinking about yourself and not about society, the environment, your country, etc. You are picking something that is good for you, even though it is detrimental to everyone else. I'm not saying people should be told what to drive, just trying to frame the argument. |
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