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The UAW and Domestic Automakers - READ ONLY

3659 messages,  Last post on Sep 19, 2006 at 6:21 PM

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Messages Page 362 of 366

#3610 of 3659 Re: Merge and purge [corsicachevy] by rockylee

Sep 19, 2006 (7:16 am)

Replying to: corsicachevy (Sep 19, 2006 7:13 am)
The pension plan is gone for any new hires, that's a guarantee. The current pension swells will drop over the years....
 
Rocky

#3611 of 3659 Re: Got a question for those... [rockylee] by nwng

Sep 19, 2006 (7:21 am)

Replying to: rockylee (Sep 19, 2006 7:05 am)
do you seriously think any cost savings that came from the merger will go to R&D?

#3612 of 3659 Re: Got a question for those... [nwng] by rockylee

Sep 19, 2006 (7:25 am)

Replying to: nwng (Sep 19, 2006 7:21 am)
I believe so....R&D is the only key for survival.
GM, is in a better situation than the others and thus are spending more R&D money, thus resulting in a small turn arounds that will eventually equal a large revamp healthier GM, IMHO
 
Rocky

#3613 of 3659 Re: Got a question for those... [rockylee] by louiswei

Sep 19, 2006 (7:32 am)

Replying to: rockylee (Sep 19, 2006 7:05 am)
No offense, but let's leave Honda out of this discussion. Just the thought of Honda being with GM alone gives me goose bumps.
 
Yes, because their (there) is plenty of competition for the consumer to choose from.
 
Yeah, but those are foreign companies, the only domestic auto manufactures left are GM and Ford. Do you honestly think it's in consumers' best interest that GM and Ford merge?
 
I think a merge could reduce the "slash and burn" effect to some degree.
 
Please explain how? When the big 2 merged (that's if they are really going to merge) some brands will be dropped. On top of my head, pontiac, Buick, Mercury and Lincoln come to my mind. Production line will be merged as well so some plants will be closed. When the plants are closed there are going to be job-slashed. Also, like you said since now the R&D and design will be done together so that many engineers, designers and lower level managements will be shown the door as well. With all those in mind please tell me how's the merger going to reduce the "slash and burn" effect like you stated? In an article from ClickonDetroit.com it says that: "This is one of those instances where 1 plus 1 equals 1.2." I think that might be a little extreme (more like 1.5) but they got a point there.Article
 
I believe both would gain market-shair (share) if the proper business module was implemented.
 
You said it there yourself. With or without merger both could and should gain market share if the proper business module was implemented. So the point right here is not about to merge or not it's about these companies are cutting corners and not following the proper business module. If they continue to do so even after the merger I don't think how they can become more successful.
 
Down to just one ? You don't think a GenFord Motors would still keep all the brands ?
 
In one I meant GM-Ford, not all their divisions. Since the domestics got so good at badge engineering I really don't see the difference in each brand anyway (especially Ford, at least GM has Cadillac).

#3614 of 3659 Re: JACK WELCH [rockylee] by brightness04

Sep 19, 2006 (7:37 am)

Replying to: rockylee (Sep 19, 2006 5:16 am)
The purpose of jobs is to create wealth. Otherwise, why don't we just give everyone a $100 million a year salary sitting on their hands? Would you be happily fed, clothed, sheltered and entertained if nothing is ever produced in the economy because everyone is sitting on their hands? The worst type of morale would be locking people into unproductive jobs. Jack Welch was very much correct that the company should only do what it was best at. That's called division of labor, the very source of the wealth of nations.

#3615 of 3659 Re: . [rockylee] by brightness04

Sep 19, 2006 (7:40 am)

Replying to: rockylee (Sep 19, 2006 5:21 am)
Please read the bonus plan again. First of all, the money is one-time only, therefore no job security at these pay levels to speak of. More importantly, the bulk of the pay is conditional (even the cash bonus is conditional), much of it in the form of stocks and options. For example, what's described as a $17 million bonus to the CFO by the critics is based on the assumption that if the stock triples in value! What they don't tell you is that the same stock option would be worth zero if the stock does not move or worse drop in price. Grabbing headlines uncritically and run with it makes for pretty weak argument.

#3616 of 3659 Re: Got a question for those... [lemko] by brightness04

Sep 19, 2006 (7:48 am)

Replying to: lemko (Sep 19, 2006 5:37 am)
GM is starting to recover from a lenghty sickness while Ford is still gravely ill.
 
Very much agree. It's funny how a couple months ago on this very forum, I had to debate UAW defenders who insisted on telling us how wonderfully Ford and Chrysler were managed compared to the incompetent GM management.

#3617 of 3659 Re: Got a question for those... [louiswei] by rockylee

Sep 19, 2006 (7:50 am)

Replying to: louiswei (Sep 19, 2006 7:32 am)
No offense, but let's leave Honda out of this discussion. Just the thought of Honda being with GM alone gives me goose bumps.
 
Honda needs a turn-around also and Rick could right it's ship also.
 
Yeah, but those are foreign companies, the only domestic auto manufactures left are GM and Ford. Do you honestly think it's in consumers' best interest that GM and Ford merge?
 
I'm a consumer and yes it's in my best interest since I dearly love both car company's.
 
Please explain how? When the big 2 merged (that's if they are really going to merge) some brands will be dropped. On top of my head, pontiac, Buick, Mercury and Lincoln come to my mind. Production line will be merged as well so some plants will be closed. When the plants are closed there are going to be job-slashed. Also, like you said since now the R&D and design will be done together so that many engineers, designers and lower level managements will be shown the door as well. With all those in mind please tell me how's the merger going to reduce the "slash and burn" effect like you stated? In an article from ClickonDetroit.com it says that: "This is one of those instances where 1 plus 1 equals 1.2." I think that might be a little extreme (more like 1.5) but they got a point there.Article
 
They'd reduce R&D, because they would beable to shair platforms and parts and designs. I agree that some would be shown the door, but they could keep the best and brightest minds. I also think GenFord could streamline the buisness reducing overall employee costs and that new over-paid Boeing CEO, could be shown the door by Rick Wagoner.
 
You said it there yourself. With or without merger both could and should gain market share if the proper business module was implemented. So the point right here that not about to merge or not it's about these companies are cutting corners and not following the proper business module. If they continue to do so even after the merger I don't think how they can become more successful.
 
I think a stream-lined buisness would yield benefits for both sides. But of course this is my opinion.
 
In one I meant GM-Ford, not all their divisions. Since the domestics got so good at badge engineering I really don't see the difference in each brand anyway (especially Ford, at least GM has Cadillac).
 
Well each brand would have to get a brand identity and stick with it if they wanted to somehow keep all brands.
 
Rocky

#3618 of 3659 Re: . [brightness04] by rockylee

Sep 19, 2006 (7:53 am)

Replying to: brightness04 (Sep 19, 2006 7:40 am)
Well I read it from the right-winged detnews. It must have some weight to the truth.
 
Rocky

#3619 of 3659 Re: Got a question for those... [rockylee] by brightness04

Sep 19, 2006 (7:55 am)

Replying to: rockylee (Sep 19, 2006 7:05 am)
Maglomania is a poor way to run business . . . Conglomeration was popular back in the 70's because back then the Wall Street promoted the wacky idea that non-industry-specific management talents can have economy of scale . . . it would make even less sense if you think the management talent is dubious to begin with.

Messages Page 362 of 366

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