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Toyota on the mend?

16273 messages,  Last post on Apr 25, 2013 at 8:21 AM

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What is this discussion about? Toyota, Automotive News

    

Messages Page 1547 of 1628

#15456 of 16273 Re: New Avalon showed [fintail] by ateixeira

Apr 06, 2012 (1:23 pm)

Replying to: fintail (Apr 06, 2012 12:50 pm)
Not sure why they decided to offer paddles, maybe just for marketing to a younger audience.
 
By younger I mean 67 instead of 73 median age.

#15457 of 16273 Next IS by ateixeira

Apr 18, 2012 (11:49 am)

I had read it would be a shortened GS, but this says otherwise:
 
http://www.autoblog.com/2012/04/16/next-gen-lexus-is-mule-caught-circulating/
 
Can you imagine Lexus dealers trying to sell boxer engines? Hard to think of a bigger mismatch.

#15458 of 16273 Re: Next IS [ateixeira] by fintail

Apr 18, 2012 (12:13 pm)

Replying to: ateixeira (Apr 18, 2012 11:49 am)
So smooth and quiet and refined, just what the L buyer wants.
 
To be fair, slap the badge on it and it will sell, just like the competing makes.

#15459 of 16273 Re: Next IS [fintail] by ateixeira

Apr 18, 2012 (1:20 pm)

Replying to: fintail (Apr 18, 2012 12:13 pm)
Well, who's to say they don't build a new FA30 engine in an H6 format? Those are quieter and smoother. Subaru could use it for the high end Outbacks.
 
There's no front half shafts, so all they need is a longer/taller nose, and it'll fit. It would not have the same front-mid engine balance, but it's less important in the IS.
 
I wonder if they'll really use that platform. I guess they need economies of scale.
 
Or they could keep the FA20 as is, and the numbers could represent the HP output. For example:
 
IS200 = 200hp, FA20 DI, N/A
IS300 = 300hp, FA20 DI turbo
 
etc.
 
I guess a boxer would be no more out of place at a Lexus dealer than in a Scion dealer...

#15460 of 16273 Re: Next IS [ateixeira] by fintail

Apr 18, 2012 (3:28 pm)

Replying to: ateixeira (Apr 18, 2012 1:20 pm)
It'll need to be amazingly refined from the current versions of that style engine, which to me sound like a lawnmower after a few years. The isotank vanilla ice milk Lexus buyer won't care for such feedback. I don't know if I can imagine it just yet.
 
We should get a diesel IS as exists elsewhere.

#15461 of 16273 Re: Next IS [fintail] by ateixeira

Apr 19, 2012 (7:57 am)

Replying to: fintail (Apr 18, 2012 3:28 pm)
Keep in mind the Germans have gone to DI (the injectors clatter) and diesels. The silky smooth normally aspirated straight sixes are being phased out.
 
The cabins are so well insulated, the glass laminated and multi-layered, so they're quiet inside even if they're noisy outside.
 
I bet the boxer's overall NVH would fall between a DI gas engine and a diesel. Par for the class nowadays.
 
The EJ25 you're used to listening to is probably noisier than the new FA series, plus the compact Impreza has much less sound insulation.
 
FWIW I like the sounds a boxer makes...

#15462 of 16273 Re: Next IS [ateixeira] by fintail

Apr 19, 2012 (8:19 am)

Replying to: ateixeira (Apr 19, 2012 7:57 am)
The old fashioned I6s at MB anyway died off some time ago. Still, from my experience, DI noise isn't as bad as boxer noise - DI seems worse when cold and fades away, boxer is always there rumbling away. If this was to exist on an IS, I don't know if the noise and vibration would be tolerated - if anything, it would be a test of how much Lexus can isolate an engine and structure. But at the same time, late model MB diesels are amazingly isolated, maybe it could be done.
 
The boxer noise is cool for the 25 year old wannabe racer in his WRX...maybe not for the 50 year old latte swiller in an IS.

#15463 of 16273 uh uh by nippononly

Apr 22, 2012 (10:21 pm)

There is no way most Lexus buyers are going to be OK with the NVH of a Subie boxer under the hood. This seems like a bit of a crazy plan, and what is going on at Toyota these days? Have they thrown in the gauntlet and conceded that they can't engineer a superior 4-cylinder engine any more so they have to have Subaru design and build their engines for them?
 
I wonder why they think it's such a good idea to lean on their partnership with Soob so much. The two companies really are quite different, and the quirkiness of the boxer should stay exclusive to the Subaru brand as much as it possibly can. I do get that they are trying to leverage their investment in the FT-86 project as much as possible here, but developing Lexuses from it is a mistake. Why not make another Scion or two? Or perhaps a (gasp!) sporty Toyota from it??

#15464 of 16273 Re: uh uh [nippononly] by steve_ HOST

Apr 23, 2012 (5:22 am)

Replying to: nippononly (Apr 22, 2012 10:21 pm)
Well, some people think that NVH stands for New Vehicle High.
 
Leaving the boxer with Scion might be the better plan though.

#15465 of 16273 Re: Next IS [fintail] by ateixeira

Apr 23, 2012 (8:09 am)

Replying to: fintail (Apr 19, 2012 8:19 am)
Lexus is the best at isolation, heck even Toyota. Dad had a diesel Land Cruiser and outside you needed ear plugs. Inside you could hardly tell the engine was running. It was incredible.
 
The newer FA engine is quieter than the EJ series despite the DI.
 
The big question is what to do with the FB engines. Subaru just launched them and Toyota stepped in and changed the bore, stroke, and added DI to create the FA series.
 
May as well just drop the FB now.
 
The 2.5l boxer you don't like (though I do) is now 2 generations old.

Messages Page 1547 of 1628

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