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Automotive News & Views Toyota in decline in 2009?
3194 messages, Last post on Nov 07, 2009 at 7:56 PM
You are in the Automotive News & Views Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & claires
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...you want to slice it, Toyota slowing down its product development cycle to conquer quality gremlins is not good. Toyota has been touted as a model of efficiency because of the advanced tech they use to speed up their cycle to 2 years or so as opposed to everyone else's 3-4 years. Apparently, it's not quite up to snuff - the simulators are missing things. Toyota's still on top, no doubt. But they are taking a step backwards while everyone else is going forward.
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Replying to: mirth (Aug 28, 2006 8:05 am) It is just a fact of the business in automobile manufacturing. Making autos is complex. Engineering is complex. There are multiple suppliers. Like many companies in the midst of a very successful growth, Toyota began to believe its own press that it could do no wrong. Toyota began to deviate from the process that brought it so successfully to where it was. Taking back what I said above, I see the development as positive. The market is in a place where it has to decide whether it wants an entirely unique car for every possible segment with the resulting quality risks, or does it want variations of platforms that allow greater quality control. I do not think the auto world is at a point where it where you can have both. As the market really seems to prefer the latter - at least the mass market - Ferrari buyers will accept technical limitations for the chance to have the perfect driving thrill - then we have to begin to accept that car companies cannot throw out a different model whenever our whim seeks it. |
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Replying to: andy82471 (Aug 28, 2006 6:09 am) "A journey of 1000 miles down the slippery slope starts with a first fall." And do we ever have a first fall!!! Don't give me that Toyota's being proactive stuff! How do you hide recalling more than 2m in America and 1M in Japan? They can't, so they do the only thing and acknowledge and apologize! There's evidence that Toyota tried its best to hide it. NYT reported 2 Toy executives were being investigated for criminal misconduct in this affair by the Japanese government. The accusation was they knew about this for the last EIGHT years!
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Replying to: mariner7 (Aug 28, 2006 8:42 am) Let's correct this paragraph: two Toyota officials are being investigated for NON-CRIMINAL charges in Japan, related to one incident involving the crash of a Toyota Hilux Surf, where there was a suspicion that steering components were to blame (hence the recall on old 4Runners and even older pick-ups last year). The investigation is occurring because there was evidence that the steering had a known fault, and these two good people (ahem! :-<) ignored this evidence, and went with the design as it already was. I owned one of the affected trucks out to 220K miles - no problems there. Toyota recalled my truck anyway, and put brand new tie rods on a 16-year-old 200K truck - certainly above and beyond the NHTSA's requirements. I would certainly encourage Toyota to slow down its production and expansion at this juncture, and get things back under control. If treading water to fix QC glitches means a year or two of just-average profits and "only" a 14% market share in the U.S., then so be it.
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Toyota's denial of problems extended all the way down to the dealer level. I took delivery of a 2005 Sienna XLE AWD that had so many problems I thought I was driving a Yugo. The dealer refused to admit even the most obvious of them. I finally made them eat the vehicle, no cost too me, or face an embarrassing law suit. If they had acknowledged the problems and at least worked with me on them I would have kept the car! (I was a mechanic for 15 years which gave me a small edge on the smoke they were blowing.) I may look at the 2007 Sienna, being a slow learner and all. |
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Replying to: nippononly (Aug 28, 2006 10:23 am) That's the right approach, Nippon. The media believes they have a 'big story' on their hands with Toyota's quality troubles. In our 24 hour media culture repetition shapes opinion. That's unfair, but it's a reality big business has to contend with. Toyota can't let this "Toyota quality is slipping" narrative gain media traction. It won't get better on its own. |
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In some forums related to GM/ Ford, I hear people (including me) screaming that quality is hurting volume. Here we are talking whether volume is hurting quality... I need a few days to gather my thoughts and to start reasoning things backwards  What does this mean for consumers like me anyway... Avoid big manufacturers  Or, avoid those who recall
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Replying to: andy82471 (Aug 28, 2006 6:09 am) That is not what this is saying; "recalls have yet to affect significantly Toyota's standings in quality surveys" indicates that there is a lag in time between the occurrence of a quality problem and the recognition of same and then the perception that Toyota vehicles are associated with quality flaws. In other words, it takes time for the truth to get out. Mercedes-Benz is a further example of this. Even though their cars are and have been filled with flaws for years they got by on reputation established in years prior before the buying public realized that buying a Benz was tantamount to gambling insofar as quality was concerned. It will be no different for Toyota as the public becomes increasingly aware that the Toyota of 2006 is not the Toyota of 1996.
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Replying to: lahiri (Aug 28, 2006 10:54 am) Can't do that unfortunately. They all recall. Honda just recalled 1.2 million vehicles because they put an 800 area code on their (888) customer care line in their manual under customer arbitration.  Apparently, the (800) number they put is a sex line, to make matters worse. 
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Replying to: priggly (Aug 28, 2006 11:53 am) The surveys are sent by people actually own the car unlike you who passes his own personal opinions as facts.
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