Last post on Nov 19, 2013 at 3:20 PM
You are in the Nissan Versa
What is this discussion about?
Nissan Versa, Hatchback, Sedan
#1050 of 1276 Re: Considering a Versa by idntnvu by backy by ba [bikedorian]
Jul 13, 2007 (9:33 am)
It was from the May 2007 issue. Here's the start of the thread in this discussion, with some more details:
backy, "Nissan Versa" #985, 31 Mar 2007 10:46 am
The point of the article was that when two Versas, one CVT and one 4AT, were compared on exactly the same highway course, the 4AT was more efficient. So maybe if you had the 4AT, you could get more than 35 mpg on the highway.
#1051 of 1276 Re: Considering a Versa by idntnvu by backy
Jul 13, 2007 (9:54 am)
Do you have a link to the article itself? One unscientific test is is just a data point. C&D is an enthusiast's publication. It's not a scientific publication so don't read too much into it. Lots of folks are posting their actual mileage figures and the CVT is the clear winner from all that I've read.
Mileage aside, the CVT is noticably quieter and smoother than the 4 speed. If the Versa had only been available with the 4 speed, I might be driving something else right now.
#1052 of 1276 Re: Considering a Versa by idntnvu by backy [bikedorian]
Jul 13, 2007 (10:50 am)
Here's the link, although the web page doesn't include the results table:
Here's what the original article had for FE results:
CVT: EPA 30/36, C/D Test Loop 33.2 mpg
4AT: EPA 28/35, C/D Test Loop 35.4 mpg
I am not sure why you think this was an "unscientific" test. Since it was done simultaneously, on the same test loop, with professional drivers and fuel measuring equipment, it seems more scientific to me than a single Versa owner reporting his/her results. And the editor, Csaba Csere, offers up some scientific rationale for why the 4AT would do better on the highway than the CVT.
Just because one publication found that the 4AT gets better fuel economy on the highway than the CVT doesn't mean the CVT isn't the right choice for you, or others. But if someone is looking for optimum fuel economy in a Versa for mostly highway cruising, the CVT may not be the best option.
#1053 of 1276 Re: Considering a Versa by idntnvu by backy
Jul 13, 2007 (11:58 am)
They don't publish scientific studies in consumer rags. Scientific studies have standardized protocols and peer review which you're not going to find in consumer rags. The CVT IS the best option if you go by actual users and both the original and revised government mileage figures. You seem to think one minor data point has greater significance than all the other evidence. We'll just have to agree to disagree.
#1054 of 1276 Re: Considering a Versa by idntnvu by backy [bikedorian]
Jul 13, 2007 (12:58 pm)
Sure. But if you have any of those scientific studies on Versa fuel economy, I'd like to see them.
#1055 of 1276 Re: Considering a Versa by idntnvu by backy [backy]
Jul 13, 2007 (4:02 pm)
here's something scientific for you
#1056 of 1276 Re: Considering a Versa by idntnvu by backy [jd10013]
Jul 13, 2007 (4:26 pm)
Yes, very technical. But it's a general paper on CVTs, not specifically about the Versa's CVT. And it doesn't tell me whether a Versa with its CVT will get better or worse fuel economy than its 4AT under certain conditions, such as highway cruising.
What did you think of C/D's theory as to why the Versa's CVT would get worse FE than the 4AT on the highway? I thought it was interesting. Also interesting that the article you linked to said the minimum FE improvement for a CVT is 7 percent, but the Versa is rated by the EPA only 1 mpg (3%) more on the highway than the 4AT. It would probably be even less of a difference (maybe no difference or a deficit?) if the Versa had an automatic with more than 4 speeds available.
#1057 of 1276 Re: Considering a Versa by idntnvu by backy [backy]
Jul 13, 2007 (5:18 pm)
its more than just a paper. they tested cvt against automatics both disconnected from, and connected to, powertrains. because of their design, and how they work, they are gaurunteed to get beter FE. not much different than how a car will get worse FE with the AC on. Taking out all the gears, and allowing the car to always be in the most fuel efficent gear ratio makes it impossible to get worse FE.
My guess as to why the versa cvt could possilby get worse MPG (if it even does) and is rated only 1 mpg better than the auto (you sure that doesn't include the MT?) would be in the programming. To the best of my knowldge, the xtronic cvt doesn't just naturaly find the best gear ratio on its own, it uses preprogramed algorithms (300 I think) to determine the best gear with factors such as power, acceleration ect taken into consideration along with MPG. I'd bet they could program it to get better MPG, but at the expense of power, acceleration ect.
#1058 of 1276 Re: Considering a Versa by idntnvu by backy [jd10013]
Jul 13, 2007 (5:40 pm)
Could be programming. Or maybe there is something to C/D's theory that the power to drive the hydraulic pump used by the CVT to control pulley spacing exceeds the hydraulic losses in the AT, especially when the lockup torque converter is engaged--such as on the highway. Maybe in theory CVTs are guaranteed to get higher FE than an AT, but sometimes reality intrudes on theory.
#1059 of 1276 Re: Considering a Versa by idntnvu by backy [backy]
Jul 13, 2007 (6:05 pm)
keep in mind, nissan's primary goal when designing a car is the driving experience. It trumps style, FE, everything. Its why they won't embrace hibrid technology. It compromises the driving experience too much. Also, I have an 07 nissan equiped with a cvt, and can tell you for a fact, it will out run the automatic. it accelerates better, and faster, not to mention smoother. Its not just equal to the AT, it's better. when nissan designed their cvt, it wasn't to make the most fuel efficent vehicle. rather, it was to make a better ridding car through the loss of shift shock, that would accelerate better and faster, while delivering slightly better FE.
Maybe in theory CVTs are guaranteed to get higher FE than an AT,
Its not just theory, they will. thats why hybrids use them.