Edmunds.com | Inside Line | Auto Observer Your Account | Help | Directory
You are here:
![[F]](http://a332.g.akamai.net/f/332/936/12h/www.edmunds.com/media/townhall/webxicons/site.gif){kind=small}
Forums
Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Mazda3 Lease Questions
445 messages, Last post on Nov 23, 2009 at 6:54 PM
You are in the Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum. Your Hosts are car_man & kyfdx
|
Just got home from the dealer: 2008 mazda 3 5 door, no options, manual transmission, 3yr. lease, 12000 miles per year. msrp= 18520 cap cost= 17500 residual= 56% money factor, unsure but around = to 6% interest rate was quoted 311 per month, 670 down (1st month, doc fee, registration) 311 includes 5 % massachusetts sales tax, and excise taxes for 3 years, gap insurance. Still seems a little high, what do you think? |
|
|
Replying to: merrydinnc (Jul 07, 2007 7:21 am) Once you have a selling price that you are comfortable with, have the dealer calculate your lease payment using its buy rate lease money factor. Vehicles' money factors vary by trim level and term. If you tell me exactly which Mazda3 you are interested in and how long you want to lease it for, I can tell you what its current money factor should be. Car_man Host Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum |
|
|
Replying to: gf2020 (Jul 08, 2007 4:36 pm) Car_man Host Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum |
|
|
Replying to: phx08 (Jul 18, 2007 11:41 am) Car_man Host Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum |
|
|
|
|
I'm completely new to leasing and trying to figure out if this is a good deal to go with. Mazda 3 5 door Grand Touring w/Moonroof + Bose package and other additions MSRP: $23,300 Selling Price: $21,600 36 month lease, 15,000 miles a year No money down Monthly lease payments of $362 ($392 total with local usage tax). Not sure of the residual value/money factor but input would be appreciated. |
|
|
I am trying to decide between leasing a 2007 s sport or touring, and identical 2008 s sport or touring. The only options on the cars would be moonroof 6cd pkg, and side curtain airbags on the 2007 s sport. I believe the only difference for 2008 is on the s sport, the side curtain airbags are now standard. The prices on these models for 2007 vs. 2008 are the same, and I have the benefit of S Plan pricing. I need to know what are the residuals and money factors for the 2008 s sport or touring models for 12k and 15k miles. I have, from Carman's post on Aug 1st, the numbers for the 2007 models. I am thinking that the residuals for the 2008 should be higher, but will that make for a better lease deal than on a 2007 with a lower selling price / cap cost? Lastly, the current dealer i am talking with has said there is a 500 rebate on the 2007 Mazda3, but I can't seem to find or confirm that anywhere on the net. I suspect they are just knocking 500 of my s plan price, which may not even be that great of a deal at this point in August. The MSRP on the 2007 s sport with delivery is 19870, and the s plan price with delivery is 18,550...so with the 500 "rebate" its 18,050. I can do the lease payment calculations and find any hidden profit, but I first need to pin them down on the selling price for this 2007 model, otherwise I think leasing the 2008 becomes more attractive. Any info would be greatly appreciated, thanks. |
|
|
Replying to: tracermag (Aug 23, 2007 9:42 am) The $500 sounds like a dealer discount. Anyway, here's a little math that can help you... P = F (A + R) + (A - R)/T This is the money factor formula that solves for the payment (P). Simply plug in the known values for Money Factor (F), Adj. Cap (A), Residual Value (R), and Term (T) in months. You can use the following identity... (V + C) - D = A to obtain... V = A - C + D where... V = Agreed Upon Value (Sell Price) A = Adj. Cap. C = Amount(s) Capitalized (i.e., financed) which may include taxes D = Cap Reduction(s) Now you have found "V", the Agreed Upon Value or sell price, which is what you want. The BEST way to proceed is for YOU to determine the sell price and NOT THE DEALER... BAD IDEA! Check edmunds or kbb for MSRP/Invoice pricing. Examine my posts in the Infiniti forums to get an idea of how to construct a one page lease proposal that you can FAX/email to the dealer. It's designed to save time, money, and aggravation. I suggest that you DO NOT put cash down as a car is a depreciating asset and, if you have a total loss, it's not likely you'll recover your down payment (cap reduction). Hope this helps. John |
|
|
Replying to: delta737h (Aug 24, 2007 4:46 am) Since I would be a ford A plan customer, and hence a Mazda S plan customer, i already know the discounted selling price / cap cost of the vehicle, except for any undisclosed dealer incentives or other discount for end of model year, which is really what I would like to find out. The dealer is "saying" the price is S plan, which is invoice price, and then less another 500 "rebate." So, my question is, would 500 below invoice be a good price on this 2007 model at this point in August, or should one expect a larger discount? I have no intention of paying doc fees, wear care, ad fees, etc., or any other hidden profit - i give them 100 to add to the selling price to get adjusted cap cost for title and registration fees and that's it - that covers the 60 dollars or so in true costs from the state and gives the dealer more than fair amount to have a runner get the papers filed, and more dealers are doing it electronically now in Ohio anyway. And tax is added to the monthly payment. I think you and I are saying the same thing, i just want to pin down the best selling price BEFORE i show them why their math is bad. Here is a tip which is a variation of your one page lease proposal: I put the formulas into an Excel spreadsheet on my laptop. On buying day, the laptop comes to the dealer with me, but stays in the car until i know what the proper selling price of the car is. Then after i get the dealer's payment, which never seems to add up based on the agreed selling price, then the lappy comes in and i let them try to explain why their math skills are so bad.  Thanks again for taking the time to respond.
|
|
|
Replying to: tracermag (Aug 24, 2007 8:42 am) A cursory look suggests to me that $500 below invoice falls within the domain of reasonableness. However, I would need to do some research that captures supply/demand considerations, incentives, etc. Having done that, I arrive at a sell price or agreed upon value. The sell price is reasonable and so I don't even consider all the other crap like doc fees, advertising, etc. And so "hidden profit" isn't even a consideration because there is none. Afterall, I'm the one that determines the selling price and, everything after that, just falls right into place. I'm always in control of the deal and that is the key. Another key to negotiating is DON'T. I have programmed my TI 84 calculator to do fairly sophisticated lease calculations and have created an excel spreadsheet that does it all including lease amortization schedules. I'm convinced my programs are superior to most, if not all, lease programs used by dealerships only because so many of them contain mathematical flaws. The numbers in my lease proposal are ALWAYS spot on. All the dealer needs to do is say YES or NO. If NO, I simply FAX/email to another dealer. If YES, they can trasfer the numbers in my proposal directly onto the lease agreement. I tell them to draw up the papers and have the keys ready because I don't want to spend any more than one-half hour at the dealership. Every number appearing in the lease contract must exactly match (to the penny) those in my proposal. I insist that the contract be completed correctly and I make that very clear to them beforehand. If their calculations don't match mine, then they made a mistake somewhere and I'm not about to argue with them or try to find their errors. They're in this business and they ought to know how the calcs are done. If not, I walk. End of discussion. Pretty simple, huh? I'm not going to get into a classroom discussion with any dealership about how they do their math. And, I'm not about to educate them either unless, of course, they are willing to compensate me. These people are not the brightest bulbs on the chandelier and academics just isn't a priority item. Most of them can't do math anyway and frequently argue that the "computer does it" with very little understanding. I am a mathematician and so leasing mathematics is a breeze for me. I can do this stuff in my sleep and they should be able to do so as well. But, that's life in America the Great. In Ohio, you have to be very careful particularly if you're considering a sign and drive lease. Dealers frequently miscalculate the payment and, hence, taxes are miscalculated as well. In Ohio, taxes are computed on the total payment. This payment is an intermediate payment, if you will, and is used only for the purpose of determining tax liability. Accordingly, it captures all taxable items capitalized in the lease. Non-taxable items (e.g., security deposit) must be kept seperate and out of this calulation. Therefore, it's important to seperate taxable items from non-taxable items. I have yet to find an Ohio dealer that can correctly compute a sign and drive lease. However, I did manage to find one dealer that agreed with my calculations after they input my numbers into their computer. However, they couldn't arrive at my numbers independently. Below is an example of what I'm talking about... _____________________________________________ 2007 Acura TSX Retail Pricing Information Base MSRP 2007Acura TSX 5 Speed Automatic (CL9687JW) ... 28,090.00 Premium Pearl White . . 0.00 Destination Charge . . 670.00 MSRP .. . ... 28,760.00 Agreed Upon Value . 26,700.00 Amounts Financed 1st Months Payment 361.71 Security Deposit .. 375.00 Acquisition Fee 595.00 Sales Tax  6.00% x 35 x 329.77
.
692.52 Capitalized Costs Gross Capitalized Cost . 28,724.23 Capitalized Cost Reduction . . 0.00 Adjusted Capitalized Cost 28,724.23 Residual Data Residual Factor .. . . 0.62 Residual Value (Residual Factor Χ MSRP) . . . 17,831.20 Cost of Money/Term Money Factor . . . 0.00127 Term (months) . 36 Lease Payment Itemization Monthly Lease Payment including Sales Tax .. . . . 361.71 Monthly Lease Payment excluding Sales Tax .. .. 340.99 Taxable Monthly Lease Payment 329.77 ________________________________________________________________________________- - - - - - - ______ Charges Payable at Lease Origination License, Title, Registration Fees (estimated) . . . . . 120.00 Amount Due at Lease Signing .... .... . 120.00 Miscellaneous GAP Coverage Included Annual Mileage Allowance: 10,000 Disposition Fee: None Excess Mileage $0.15 per mile Reg. M Disclosure: NA ____________________________________________ John Medina, Ohio PS: If you're near Medina (near Cleveland), maybe we can have a cup of coffee. Good luck my friend. |
|
|
Replying to: tracermag (Aug 24, 2007 8:42 am) One other area that I forgot to mention and that is the reserve level associated with the cost of money (i.e., money factor, interest rate). When I'm in the data collection mode, I always ask the dealer for the rate with 0% reserves. That rate is called the base rate or buy rate. Reserves work in much the same way that points do on mortgage loans. It is a form of dealer participation ( hidden profit) where the fund provider compensates the dealer for writing the lease at a higher money factor or interest rate. And so, reserves is another potential profit center for the dealer. For example, a fund provider's tiered rate structure might look something like this... 0.00130 + 0% reserves 0.00150 + 1% reserves 0.00170 + 2% reserves A 2% reserve level means that the dealer receives 2% of the adjusted capitalized cost (excluding any acquisition/bank fee). The customer never sees the 2% because it's embedded in the money factor or interest rate. So, I suppose that would be classified as financing hidden profit. Aware of this "hidden profit", I always ask for the buy rate. If the dealer insists on 1% or 2% reserves, I simply deduct the dollar equivalent from the agreed upon value. Sort of like the Rob Peter to Pay Paul Principle. They can jack up the rate as much as they like and I just deduct it from the sell price and use the result as my new sell price. John |
|
You are here:
Forums
Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Mazda3 Lease Questions
New? Join Now!
Forum Tools
Search Forums
Browse by Vehicle
2010 Mazda MAZDA3
Browse by Board
Browse by Topic
Today's Chats
