- #2670 of 3185
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Re: BMW fees - what's BS, what's real? (Part II) [kyfdx]
by joesao
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Jan 13, 2009 (6:02 pm)
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Replying to: kyfdx (Jan 13, 2009 4:18 pm)
kyfdx,
To scrutinize the inception fees, what's legit here?
I'm being quoted:
- First monthly payment (ok, seems legit 
- License & registration $110.00
- MVWEA $2.00 (no idea what this is)
- Rental surcharge $60
- Tire $5
- Battery $1.50
- Tag agency fee $20
- Tag processing fee $95
- Cap reduction tax $4.38
- State tax on fees $9.69
- County tax on fees $1.62
- Count cap red tax 0.73
- Customer cash as cap reduction $72.99
Incidentally, the total here (including the first month's payment) adds up to exactly 1,000 which is what I told the dealer would be my maximum out of pocket.
I made it clear that I would only pay tag, title, taxes, and first month's payment. I find it fascinating that he was able to conjure up enough other fees and taxes to make the number add up perfectly.
Therefore, I am inclined to believe that some of these are BS fees. Which ones?
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- #2671 of 3185
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Re: BMW inception fees / custom ordering [amylock]
by Car_man HOST
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Jan 14, 2009 (3:45 am)
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Replying to: amylock (Jan 07, 2009 10:26 am)
Hi Amy. Here's the information that you're looking for. BMW Financial Services' January buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2009 335i with 15,000 miles per year are .00200 and 56%, respectively.
Car_man
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- #2672 of 3185
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Re: [byrne222]
by Car_man HOST
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Jan 14, 2009 (3:55 am)
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Replying to: byrne222 (Jan 07, 2009 11:06 am)
Hi Max. BMW Financial Services' current buy rate lease money factor for a 36 month lease of a 2009 328i xDrive Sedan with 15,000 miles per year are .00175 and 57%, respectively. The numbers for an otherwise identical lease on an '09 335i xDrive Sedan are .00200 and 56%.
BMW FS' 36 month, 15k numbers for the '08 328xi Sedan are .00115 and 54%. The numbers for an otherwise identical lease of an '08 335xi Sedan are .00130 and 54%.
Car_man
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- #2673 of 3185
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Re: BMW inception fees / custom ordering [joesao]
by Car_man HOST
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Jan 14, 2009 (4:02 am)
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Replying to: joesao (Jan 08, 2009 2:01 pm)
No problem, joesao. Yep, I've spoken with several BMW dealers who are pretty annoyed that the January programs are so much worse than the December program was. Oh well, if sales are bad enough, they'll just have to crank the support back up again.
Car_man
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- #2674 of 3185
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Re: 2009 328CIC [davidt1]
by Car_man HOST
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Jan 14, 2009 (4:07 am)
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Replying to: davidt1 (Jan 08, 2009 5:21 pm)
Hi David. You were smart to lock in BMW's December lease program. It was better than the January program is. BMW Financial Services' January buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2009 328Ci Convertible with 12,000 miles per year are .00205 and 60%, respectively. Not only is the lease program worse, but as you mentioned BMW raised prices on January as well. Needless to say, BMW dealers are not pleased.
Car_man
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- #2675 of 3185
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Re: BMW fees - what's BS, what's real? (Part II) [joesao]
by kyfdx HOST
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Jan 14, 2009 (4:18 am)
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Replying to: joesao (Jan 13, 2009 6:02 pm)
I don't know every fee for your state, but none of those raise any red flags. There could be some padding in there, but if so, it's minimal. The reason it came out to exactly $1000? Customer cash as cap reduction $72.99 The fees actually came out to a little less.. They just used the excess to reduce the CAP cost of your lease (a downpayment).
regards,
kyfdx
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- #2676 of 3185
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Re: BMW inception fees / custom ordering [Car_man]
by peteynorge
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Jan 14, 2009 (11:42 am)
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Replying to: Car_man (Jan 14, 2009 3:45 am)
Why is the money factor so different from the current interest rate they're offering? For example, a money factor of .00200 is translated into an interest rate of 4.8% (right?), but they are currently offering 2.9% on 2009 335i sedans. Is there any way to bargain down the money factor to be comparable to a 2.9% interest rate (0.00120 MF)?
In general, are the money factor and residual you mentioned just the advertised numbers, and can you possibly negotiate them, or are they final numbers?
Thanks in advance
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- #2677 of 3185
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Re: BMW inception fees / custom ordering [peteynorge]
by Car_man HOST
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Jan 15, 2009 (2:50 am)
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Replying to: peteynorge (Jan 14, 2009 11:42 am)
Hi peteynorge. Manufacturers' special financing rates and special lease money factors are often significantly different. The lower finance rate indicates to me that either BMW is spending so much money in residual value support that it isn't willing to provide any more support to buy down its money factors OR that it would much rather have consumers finance its vehicles than lease them because leasing leaves them open to potentially large residual value losses down the road.
The money factors and residual values that I mention in these forums are the best available deal. Dealers do not have the authority to alter banks' published residual values, but they are often allowed to mark up their money factors to add additional, hidden back-end profit to deals. BMW dealers are notorious for marking up money factors. This is why it is important that you check that you are being charged the buy rate any time you lease one.
Car_man
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- #2678 of 3185
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Re: January lease programs vs. december
by banker2
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Jan 15, 2009 (9:21 am)
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Replying to: Car_man (Jan 14, 2009 4:02 am)
I agree the January programs are significantly different than December. For example, I was looking to lease a 2009 328i sedan.......in December, the money factor was .00150 (3.6%) and the residual was 62% for a 36 mo. lease with 12K miles/year. In January, I was told the money factor is now .00230 (5.5%) and the residual was 60%. The increase in money factor and and decrease in residual created a $75 difference in payment amount, all other things being equal. I understand the residual going down a bit since we've rolled over to a new year, but I'm surprised BMWFS is raising rates right now when interest rates in general are coming down. Maybe they are cutting production sufficiently to hold their ground on some of their terms? I'm holding out and will look for something else in the meantime.
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- #2679 of 3185
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Re: January lease programs vs. december [banker2]
by peteynorge
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Jan 15, 2009 (2:52 pm)
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Replying to: banker2 (Jan 15, 2009 9:21 am)
Does anyone have an educated guess on if the MF and residual values will get better or worse? According to bmwusa.com, the current lease offers are good through March 2nd. Any ideas on what the rates might be after March 2nd? I'm trying to decide if I should just lease now or wait till after March 2nd.
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