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Acura TL, Car Leasing, Sedan
#1006 of 3035 Re: how cheap TL-S [23109vc] (reply) [vegasrph] [23109vc] [vegasrph]
Dec 09, 2007 (5:03 pm)
the MDX is great. we did a no down lease. we paid somethingl ike 900 in fees but no "cap reduction". we got a tech model that also had a few dealer add ons, nice running boards, and the roof racks/cross bars. we pay 650/month INCLUDING tax. i think it was like 610 or something before 600-604/month before taxes. not bad but at the time we got ours they were brand new and NO ONE was budging..i haggled my a$$ of to get that deal. the deal ont he TL-S is way better.
i'm trying to talk myself into doing it. i currently have a 1999 S70 w/about 130k on the odomete.r it runs nice, is paid off, and is worth 4k or so in trade. if I were to keep that thing 3 more y ears, (and i HATE this car it's relatively FAST with a cat back exhaust on it..stock hp was like 240 and it's lighter than a TL...so i bet it runs the 1/4 in high high 14s to 15 flat easy...it's quick..but it handles like CRAP and is a box. no car payment...but it's still worth 4-5k and every year i keep it it will depreciate another grand or so as it ages and goes up in miles. plus it's gonna keep nickel and diming me on repairs over 36 months as it ages. i figure my true "cost" of driving the beat up volvo over the next 36 months is the 4-5k I lose as it's value approaches/nears ZERO,a nd another 2-3k in repairs that will probably crop up over 36 months. so you could say it will "cost" me 7-8k to drive this car into the ground. assuming it's worthless or near worthless in 3 years. it' won't be, but in 3 years with 150-160k on it, it will be worth maybe a grand or two if that.
a TL-S..given the current deals, will cost me something like $450/month to lease (which is effectively paying hte depreciation on that car) - and I can trade in my S70 and burn up it's value to redue the cost of the lease. o r I could just sell the volvo outright and pocket 5k and "save" spending ANYmoney on repairs over the next 36 months.
if you add up the lease payments of 450 * 36 months you get roughly $16,200. if I jsut kep my POS volvo, I'll "pay" 8000 in costs....repairs plus lost equity in my car or the depreciation over time as it becomes worthless.
so essentially, to lease the TL costs me 8000 MORE than my current situation - spread over 36 months. which is a little over 200/month. not a bad price to pay for a bad a$$ sport sedan, nav, better handling, NO breakdowns, roadside assistance, the cool BT phone, a stereo that works (mine is bused in the volvo), etc etc.
in 36 months, if i keep the volvo, it will be worthless and about to blow up. if i do the TL-s I can buy it or walk away - either scenario I'm left with "nothing". i just can keep the status quo and drive my volvo...or get a tL and accept a 200-225/month bump in car costs.
or am I just telling myself nonsense voodoo math to justify buyijng a car id on't need???? my wife would say the latter. of course SHE has the MDX to drive...
another unquantifiable factor is that i am a car freak. i love cars. if i wasn't married wih three kids, an dhad my same income..i'd be driving a TL as my daily driver and have a 911 or boxster S as a toy car... i read R&T C&D every month...and drool over cars on the intenet like other guys drool over porn... driving my lame ass volvo pains me. to have a cool car would seriously up my mental well being. maybe that makes me shallow...or a snob..or whatever..but that's how i am. i don't go for jewelry, or lavish vacations... i love cars. if i had no kids, hell i'd have some two seater roadster to tear up the streets...but with kids..someting like a TL-S, 335, Audi S4, is the ideal car.
(i used to have an S60R a year ago, but sold it when baby #3 came and we needed the MDX...my S60R had miles on it, was gonna cost me $$ in repairs so i unloaded it, profited some money (aka cut my losses) and got the MDX. now i'm dying for a fun car again. not interested in another volvo and my MDX is amazing..which makes me want another acura...
thanks for letting me vent guys.
#1007 of 3035 Re: how cheap TL-S [23109vc] (reply) [vegasrph] [23109vc] [vegasrph] [23109vc]
Dec 09, 2007 (10:06 pm)
Dude, I hear you and agree. I am 6'5" tall, so unfortunately I can't "fit" into alot of the cars I drool over as well when I read R&T, Motor Trend, etc. I would LOVE to have a Porsche Boxter/Cayman, Honda S2000, or even a Mazda Miata for a "toy" to go out and drive on weekends. Too bad I can't fit in any of those.
I did have a 2003 Nissan 350Z (loved it), but it was my daily driver (not so good for that). A Corvette (new 08) would be my only reasonable option for a "toy", but it isn't feasable right now.
So.........the Acura TL-S will have to do. Yeah, its front wheel drive, yeah its NOT a BMW (well, that can be a good thing.....read my earlier post), yeah it has a CASSETTE DECK (what the??? who has these anymore??)..........but.......its got 286HP, paddle shifters, NAV, sport seats/suspension, looks, and THE PRICE is hard to beat!!
I like the Acura, its a GREAT front wheel drive car........even with torque steer. I can fit in it, it looks great, has a trunk that can hold golf clubs, comes LOADED, and it won't break the bank.
Right now, thru 1/2/08, its really hard to pass up the TL. I mean, you get so much car for so little money.........why not??
#1008 of 3035 lease vs buy a TL-S
Dec 12, 2007 (1:10 pm)
given the lease MF vs the $2000 off for purchases - would you buy or lease this thing?
I have a trade that is worth about 4k. When I run the numbers on a lease (using my $4k in trade as cap reduction) vs a purchase at ballpark 5% interest, with a 4k down payment, assuming 72 months financing, it's still cheaper to lease.
the downside to the lease is that at the end of 36 months, you have "nothing". no equity, you just give the car back, and that 4k cap reduction, and payments all were like "rent" for a car.
the downside to buying, in my opinion, is that to get a payment even CLOSE to a lease payment, you need to stretch financing out to 60-72 months. then what happens is by the time you get to the 36-48 month range, your warranty is expiring, and in general, given the length of your repayment schedule and the typical depreciation curve - you really aren't ahead. you might be a tad upside down or a tad right side up, but basically, you owe what the car is worth. you'd need to get into the last year of your loan to really have "equity". so SIX years down the raod, i'd own a car that is now worht what? something..yeah..but how much have I blown in repairs, trips back forth to the shop, on a car that now has 90k miles on it....
i guess in the long run, it may be more cost effective to buy, because 5-6 years later you "own" it and the car WILL have value...so you own it...you've paid lets say $35k to buy it, and in 6 years, it's worth maybe 10k...i dunno... maybe 6-8k... so if you factor that in, you are ahead...
to me, in the short run, leasing is cheaper and more convenient. unless you want to keep the car 10 years. problem is, even with an Acura, when a car gets that old, it has problems, it's not fun anymore, you want somethign new, etc. no warranty sucks too.
my current car is 8 years old, and i've easily spent a few grand in the past fwe years fixing it. so it's paid off, but i pay here and there for repairs. i sometimes feel i'd be better fof spending a bit more every month to have a new car, instead of having no car payment, but getting hit every 6 months with an 800 repair. and driving somethig unreliable..
#1009 of 3035 2008 TL-S or wait for 2009
Dec 12, 2007 (1:13 pm)
i'm price conscious.
the current lease deals on teh TL are attractive. i love the car, my ONLY beef iwth it, after a test drive of both the auto and 6 speed, is the torque steer. the stick was much worse. if i get one, i'll get the auto..but they all did it to an extent.
research and rumors on teh web are that 2009 will be AWD. but will it be a lot more $$. i assume they won't deal much on price.
i can lease a TL-S now for a great deal. i've seen guys putting down $1000 and having $450/month payments.... cap costs of $35k or 33500. i wonder if the 2009 will be priced the same, and so buying a 2008 now will make me kick myself in 12 months when the 09s are on teh lot at the SAME price with AWD...or if they will be over 40k and to get one, would have cost me $100+ more per month, which I would NOT pay, so I won't care.
anyone care to guess?
2009 will have AWD?
will it cost more?
how much more?
lease a 2008 TL-S NOW vs wait for a 2009 TL and lease it then. how much MORE would that 09 model run per year vs the deals now? $100+/month more??
#1010 of 3035 Re: lease vs buy a TL-S [23109vc]
Dec 12, 2007 (3:24 pm)
LEASE IT. It doesn't make sense to "own" cars anymore. Who actually "owns" it anyway?? If you have a payment, the BANK owns it. Most of the time you will be "upside down" in a purchase until the 42-48 month of ownership, then what? I'll tell you........you have a car that you:
DON'T WANT (now its been replaced by a newer model/or your tastes change)
Have to put $$$$ into, because it needs a battery, tires (again), brakes (again), more wiper blades, etc.
Is out of (or near) warranty, and any major service will cost you more $$$$
Can't sell..........Get "hosed" on a trade.....for any number of reasons listed above.
Ask any financial advisor.........a vehicle "purchase" is the worst move you can make. Vehicles depreciate, so put your extra $$$ in something that appreciates!! Like a house, 401k fund, college fund, savings CD, rainy day fund, etc.
#1011 of 3035 Re: lease vs buy a TL-S [vegasrph]
Dec 12, 2007 (3:52 pm)
ok that being said:
suppose I lease.
do you lease an 08 or wait for an 09??? arrgghh..
how cheap do you think I can get them down to on an 08 lease? i went today at lunch to check out the local dealer (didn't test drive..might do it after work tonight when i have more time) and the dealer flat out said he would move it at invoice. he didn' tsay what THAT was...so maybe he thought I hadn't done homework and they would just say it was invoice and mark it up..
but given the knowledgeon this board, and being able to know WHAT invoice really is..is it likely to get a dealer down BELOW invoice on a lease and get the .00081 MF or is invoice pretty much *IT*...
at some point they just won't go any lower...where is THAT point.
$33500 for a TL-S??
#1012 of 3035 Re: lease vs buy a TL-S [23109vc]
Dec 12, 2007 (7:03 pm)
Lease an 08 or 09 or 2010 is really up to you. Do you need a car now? Or can you wait 12-24 months? The Acura Special on the TL's ends on 1/2/08. You must take delivery on or before 1/2/08 to get the Special Lease (MF 0.00081). After 1/2/08, it will change.
To answer your question as best I can, you can find the "invoice" for all 2008 Acura models by doing a simple google search OR use edmunds.com and see if they have the 2008 invoices posted yet. Last time I looked, Edmunds didn't have the 2008 invoices, but Acura only increased them $100 vs 2007.
IF you get a 2008 Acura TL-Type S for $33,500..........I want to know the name of that dealer.........I'll take ONE, too!!
I got 2 different dealerships to go "invoice" on a 2008 TL Type S. The price varied only by a FEW DOLLARS. One quote was $35,840. The other was $35,716.
Remember........the MSRP is $38,940 (inc destination). There is NO WAY you will be able to get this car for $33,500...........shoot for $35,000 (under invoice) and be very happy at $35,700 - $35,900 (right at invoice).
Don't let the dealer move the MF from 0.00081 (1.95%), make them show you every calculation they are doing in your deal.
**If you are just looking for a CHEAP Acura TL lease, look at the TL (NO Navi). I got a quote for Cap Cost of $31,900 (MSRP $34,440) and with $1,000 due at signing it was $360/mo (+ tax) with 10k miles a year for 36 months.
The residual is HIGHER on the BASE TL (59%) vs the Type S (56%).........and the car is less expensive, too!!!
Good luck with your deal. The $33,500 2008 Acura TL Type S is a "pipe dream", but don't feel bad if you get one for invoice or $100-$200 below.....that's a GREAT deal!!
#1013 of 3035 Re: Looks like Acura has some great TL lease deals!! [vegasrph]
by Car_man HOST
Dec 13, 2007 (3:40 am)
Hello vegasrph. Honda Finance's current buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a base 2008 Acura TL without navigation with 12,000 miles per year are .00081 and 58%, respectively for consumers who qualify for its top credit tier. The numbers for an otherwise identical lease of an '08 TL Type-S are .00081 and 55%. These cars' 10,000 mile per year residual values are 1% higher.
Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
#1014 of 3035 Re: Leased TL Navi - northern NJ [jaybee85]
by Car_man HOST
Dec 13, 2007 (3:42 am)
You're very welcome, jaybee85. Congratulations on getting your new TL. It sounds like you got a very good deal. Thanks for taking he time to stop back and let us all know how everything turned out. Make sure to stop by the new Dealer Ratings & Reviews section of Edmunds.com to share your thoughts on your recent dealer experience. Enjoy your new ride .
Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
#1015 of 3035 Re: deals in the southeast [cndnbkn]
by Car_man HOST
Dec 13, 2007 (4:03 am)
Hello cndnbkn. You are correct, the dealer cash that Acura is currently providing on the Acura TL is not compatible with its special lease program. Honda Finance's current buy rate lease money factor for the 2008 TL is .00081 for consumers who qualify for its top credit tier. You can look up the dealer invoice price for the TL that you are interested in by visiting the New Vehicle Pricing section of Edmunds.com.
Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum