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Mercedes-Benz M-Class, Mercedes-Benz
#1 of 17 Mercedes' new 32-valve V8
Aug 09, 2005 (7:46 pm)
It was written in a recent auto review that, "Mercedes' new 32-valve V-8 won't find its way into the M-class for at least a year." As the driver of a '03 ML500, I appreciate MB's current V8.
Even so, the link below ("DaimlerChrysler AG Mercedes 5L SOHC V-8") not only talks about what is to be liked about MB's current V8, it also provides interesting comparative data for the next one:
e.g., "The 500E's V-8 [from the '90's] made 322 hp and 354 lb.-ft. of torque."
The stats for MB's current "350" V6, factored up to a V8--4.67L making 357 hp and 344 ft. lbs. of torque--compares pretty well to the stats for the 500E powerplant that apparently offered awesome power in its day, and that makes me pretty interested to consider the next ML with the new V8, especially if it is in the ~$50K price range instead of the 500E's $80K.
It also is interesting to see how well the current 5L V8 holds up under the same comparison, i.e., at 325 ft. lbs. of torque at the same low 2700 rpm, the current "500" would be closer to matching the new V8 that that it was to the venerable 500E's powerplant.
What I think would be most interesting, however, is if MB's new V8, when matched with the new 7-spd tranny, might allow the new ML to post expected hwy miles of more than 22 mpg--while towing a 21' V8-inboard--because that would be better than my old VW beetle..
#2 of 17 Re: Mercedes' new 32-valve V8 [mac320]
Aug 09, 2005 (8:22 pm)
The new V8 specs have been released already. The 4.5L V8 will make 342hp and the 5.5L will make 388hp, then subtract about 6 hp for each for the U.S. market.
It is well known that the new V8s won't make it into the M,E,CLS,SL,R and next gen G-Class until the 2007 model year.
That would be too many models to update at once I think. The new S-Class will run the new V8 for about 4-6 months before everything else starts to get it.
The new AMG V8 will also show up in various AMG models for the 2007 model year also.
The current 4.3 and 5.0L SOHC V8s served their purpose well and were pretty good tech-wise up until a few years ago. The 5.0L is especially dated when it comes to hp for an engine of that size, and it has only a slight torque advantage compared to some smaller competitor V8s.
#3 of 17 Re: Mercedes' new 32-valve V8 [merc1]
Aug 20, 2005 (7:15 am)
Interesting: 5.5L is the displacement of MB's AMG-tuned V8 (24-valve non-supercharged) that delivers 362 hp. Based on the avilable hp, providing 388 hp for a non-AMG V8 of the same displacement--and probably at a much more conservative compression as well--is siginificant.
#4 of 17 Re: Mercedes' new 32-valve V8 [mac320]
Aug 20, 2005 (9:43 am)
Yes...I agree. For a 5.5L V8, 388hp is very conservative IMO. Especially since this new unit is of the DOHC,32V variety with all the breathing tricks introduced on the new V6 last year. It has always been said that MB goes for durability and long life compared to outright hp superiority on their regular lineup engines. They have never had class leading hp, but usually have class leading torque though. I suspect that next round of AMG models of the SLK,CLK and C-Class will get an AMG version of this new 5.5L with 420+ hp.
#5 of 17 Re: Mercedes' new 32-valve V8 [merc1]
Aug 27, 2005 (6:03 pm)
the next S500's 383 ft. lbs of torque--from the new V8 probably (which means some huge 333 ft. lbs of it is probably available at just 1500 rpm)--will be an impressive contribution to performance. I think I would like to have a ML500 with that engine.
#6 of 17 Re: Mercedes' new 32-valve V8 [mac320]
Sep 14, 2005 (4:29 am)
You will get that chance for the 2007 model year ML500.
#7 of 17 Re: Mercedes' new 32-valve V8 [merc1]
Sep 16, 2005 (9:05 pm)
It is interesting that an even newer engine technology, a 32-valve, 6.2L V8, may show up even sooner in the ML than the V8 version of the current “350” engine—making its debut appearance in the ML before appearing in any other MB model—as the ML63 AMG.
According to the above, MB even pulled 2-ton trailers in the hills of Germany with it. Although I guess it probably will be a $75K ML, it does seem to be an impressive drivetrain, and very exclusive considering only 100 engines per day are to be hand built and apparently will power all AMGs across MB's line (eg., the E55 with a 5-spd auto will be replaced by an E63 with a 7-spd tranny, and etc.).
#8 of 17 Re: Mercedes' new 32-valve V8 [mac320]
Sep 17, 2005 (11:12 am)
Yeah that was a curious decision to debut such an engine in a SUV. I suspect that the next car will be the CLK, since for 2006 CLK55 AMG Coupe has been dropped from the U.S. lineup.
Since the facelifted E and SL aren't ready for viewing yet, the next CL hasn't been presented, and the S-Class introduction already has enough content, AMG had no other "new" or newer model to debut the engine in. My pick would have been the CLS first. But the CLS did debut as a 2006 model so it has a while to go before the 2007 model year here in the U.S. I'm reading that the ML63 will be here next spring or early summer which is about the time the ML500 should be the new V8 from the S-Class. I'm curious as to whether or not there will be any "450" variants of the ML or R-Class in this country. The upcomming S450's 4.6L V8 should make about 335hp.
I'm a little worried that this new AMG engine won't equal or surpass the performance of the current 5.5L SC V8 in the E,S,CL,SL, and CLS "55" models because it doesn't have as much torque. On the German car boards they're telling me not to worry because the new engine's lighter weight combined with the 7-speed tranny will equal the straight-line performance of today's SC cars, and provide better handling as a result of less weight. We'll see.
#9 of 17 Re: Mercedes' new 32-valve V8 [merc1]
Sep 17, 2005 (6:35 pm)
Well, here are my guesses . . .
MB has been doing eveything from low displacement V6s to high-perf., SC'd V8s (and V12s too) with the same 90-degree "V" block. Now that improved heads have been added to it (retiring the twin spark, three valves per cylinder heads), I thought the next improvement would be direct injection.
Maybe the ML63's new block--that among other things does not require cylinder sleeves--will be the next all-purpose component block and will replace the current block across the MB line.
#10 of 17 Re: Mercedes' new 32-valve V8 [mac320]
Sep 18, 2005 (11:34 pm)
I doubt if the tech from the new AMG V8 will spread across the MB lineup, too expensive I think. From everything I'm seeing about this new V8, its literally a racing engine, just like the V10 in the BMW M cars. That kind of tech costs.
Direct-injection - I could have sworn the new 3.5L V6 was direct injection when I first read about it, but it isn't.
In the hybrid S-Class the 3.5L V6 is fitted with direct injection and it makes 292hp. That may be added to the E350 and the S350 when the E is facelifted and if MBUSA decided to bring over the new S-Class in "350" form.