Last post on Jun 22, 2011 at 5:56 AM
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Lexus ES 350
#2730 of 2769 Re: 2008 also deficient [Mike]
Dec 16, 2009 (3:25 pm)
Just found an additional whine. In addition to the multitude of design errors such as no hanger hooks, poor linterior lighting, poor cabin storage, no fold down seat passing thru to trunk, the ES350 has no way to hook or tie down the trunk in the rare event that it becomes necessary. The guys that designed this car had their heads where the "sun don't shine". These are easy fixes and by 2010, I have my fingers crossed. Has anyone heard of corrections for the 2010? The competition in this class is brutal.
After owning this 2008 for some time though, it is still pretty to look at and a great highway car that gets very nice fuel efficiency.
#2731 of 2769 Re: 2008 also deficient [Mike]
Jan 07, 2010 (11:57 am)
I would 2nd your previous comment about the design virtues of an Audi A6. We leased an '03 that was a great car. We have returned to another ES after the Audi and an Acura TL.
Regarding your complaints about the design errors in the ES, I would say that they have corrected one, the hanger hooks, but that the others still remain. I have heard that the front armrest storage has improved for 2010, but can't verify.
The interior lighting still seems weak and there's only the ski pass-thru to the trunk. Better than nothing, but we'd prefer fold down seats.
Unfortunately, as good as the A6 is, the price has gone to the stratosphere with options that we have on our ES. We considered the A4, which has almost reached the size of the old A6, but even it's price comes to the mid 40's with just the 4 cylinder engine.
Whatever it's shortcomings, the ES continues to offer an incredible value for the price. That, and the good dealer sales & service experience we had with our previous ES brought us back. Once again, the sales experience was absolutely first class.
#2732 of 2769 Re: 2008 also deficient [johnva]
Jan 08, 2010 (6:27 am)
Yes, I noticed the creeping price differential. The A6 Audi is way up there now. The ES350 does have many virtues. Many of the design errors that have been noted could be solved with a small expenditure of effort and money that it is hard to understand why there has been no execution. I read all the car mags and the top line of many lower regarded marques have more and smarter features. Was just reading about the Subaru Outback Sedan. Yeah, the rear seats fold down! And in Audi-like fashion, all wheel drive. But, the Lexus marque has considerable "snoot" factor that has been earned by producing a high quality product. That counts too.
#2733 of 2769 Re: he was a chp officer [frodot]
Jan 08, 2010 (10:19 pm)
Come on now...I am a police officer as well and I own a 45k MDX. You do not know what model he had..it could have been a MY 2000 that he bought for 10k. Also, how do you know that his wife didn't have a well paying job that he could of afforded a Lexus. Since he was 45, he could have been a CHP for over 20 years and making near a $100k. For you to say that he had financial difficulty without knowing anything about his life is plain old stupid!!! Trust me, cops ARE normal people. We panic like everyone else. I have never been trained to drive a car that has the accelerator being stuck. He had his family in the car and everyone was probably yelling and panicking that maybe he couldnt concentrate as well. Don't know if the car had a fault or not, but your statements that you made were idiotic.
#2734 of 2769 Re: 2008 also deficient [Mike]
Jan 13, 2010 (7:35 am)
Another stupid design feature or lack thereof, is the lack of any tiedown capability for the trunk. We have a truck up north but when we are in Florida for the winter this Lexis becomes a hauler on occasion. The A6 Audi with fold down rear seats beat this by a mile. I would love to talk to someone involved in the design of this car. The design team had their heads where the sun doesn't shine. I hear the mistakes are uncorrected even into 2010.
For all of these negatives, it is still a nice car as far as I am concerned. And from a safety standpoint, OK. RE: sudden acceleration -I can see that if the mats were deliberately unfastened, this could be problematic but, DAH, nothing movable except the drivers feet should should be in the drivers footwell.
Jan 18, 2010 (4:59 am)
I bought a 2009 ES350 just about a year ago. It was my first Lexus. Since then I have had numerous chipped paint spots on the car. I owned a Ford Taurus for 10 years and might have had 2 or 3 spots in all those years. After I noticed the first one, I bought some touch up paint and since then I've practically gone through a small bottle.
Sometimes the damage is obvious, like someone opening a door against the car, or front bumper hitting a parking garage wall when trying to park to close. Others are very small, the size of the head of a pin. I found a forum dedicated to this exact problem and even an attorney's web page looking to start a class action suit. So I know I'm not alone. Anyone with similar experience and suggestions for getting Lexus to fix it?
#2736 of 2769 Re: Chipped paint? [timwilmath]
Jan 18, 2010 (8:52 am)
Have same problem and have read other similar comments. Paint seems very thin like the cars of 1978-1980 or so. Did not know about a possible class action lawsuit. I have never complained to the dealer because I bought with 14K miles and do not know the previous history. But, I know the paint is not right. Class action would be of interest to me.
#2737 of 2769 Re: kennynmd's response to "He was a CHP officer"
Feb 08, 2010 (4:43 pm)
I concur with kennynmd. I spent 32 years as a cop in a large department in Northern California. Trust me, compared to many citizens, we (cops) are uber-normal.
I followed the news about the accident involving the CHP officer and members of his family intently, not because I'm a retired cop, but because I purchased an '09 ES350 a few weeks before the accident made the news. From what I have read and seen in news reports, the loaner Lexus the CHP officer was driving was outfitted with an all-weather floor mat installed by the dealer and not intended for the vehicle. It was believed to have been the cause of the jammed accelerator. The 911 call was made from the officer's brother-in-law who was sitting in the back seat. An audio recording of the 911 call was released to the media a few weeks ago. Having heard it twice, it was apparent that the brother-in-law was on the line with the 911 operator right up to the moment of the accident.
While I'm not privy to the CHP's MAIT report of the accident, it has been reported that several witnesses have given statements saying that they saw smoke coming from all four wheels of the Lexus, indicating that the officer was applying full brake force while the car was speeding out of control. No one knows at what point the officer began applying the brakes. Presumably it was the moment he realized the car was accelerating on its own, and since he was on the highway as opposed to a surface street, it seem likely that he was already traveling at 60 or better. With the car under full throttle, the Lexus would have shifted down one or two gears, giving a significant amount of acceleration power for the brakes to overcome. In a matter of seconds the brakes would have become overheated and next to worthless at stopping the car with the accelerator pedal still floored.
I'm sure that kennynmd can testify to the fact that a surge of adrenalin can radically alter what would normally be common sense responses during moments of panic. Ask any officer who has experienced a wild hot chase.
Early in my career I responded to a call of an in-progress burglary at 2:30 in the morning in a residential area. As I crept up to the address in my 1970 Plymouth patrol car, the burglar took off in his late '60s Impala. I tried to stop him with my reds and a blurp from my siren, but he took off, and we were soon traveling in excess of 70 mph on surface streets. At the time, I was a two-footed driver, using my left foot for the brake and my right for the accelerator. (This was long before my department developed a high-speed driving course we had to attend annually to sharpen our driving skills.)
When the burglar attempted to make a 90-degree left-hand turn onto a main thoroughfare in the heart of the city, I instinctively knew he was going far too fast to make it. Sure enough, he slid sideways into a light standard at the intersection. I didn't even attempt to make the turn. Instead, I kept the patrol car headed straight and stood on the brakes. Hard. Really hard. As hard as I possibly could, but my car wouldn't stop. It was no longer accelerating, but it wouldn't stop. It then flashed in my mind that I was pushing as hard on the brake with my left food as I was pushing on the throttle with my right. After immediately removing my right foot from the accelerator, the brakes were so hot by then they would only have a minimal slowing effect. When my partner and I finally bailed out of our patrol car that was now stopped in the middle of the street a half block beyond the crashed burglar's car, the first thing we noticed was the smoke and smell coming from the our car's brakes. This incident cured me from being a two-footed driver. It also taught me what it's like to try and stop a car at speed using the brakes while the throttle is pressed against the floorboard.
I feel it's unfair to make any judgments about what the officer behind the wheel in the loaner Lexus did or didn't do, especially without knowing all the facts. And I suspect that the officers who made up the elite CHP MAIT team that investigated the accident would say the same thing. The only thing everyone should agree on is that it was a terrible tragedy.
I will say this: Every time I get behind the wheel of my '09 ES350, I glance down at my factory floor mat to make sure I can see that the hook in the floor extends through the hole in the mat. And I am fully aware that if I need to shut the engine down at speed, I need to depress the Ignition Start button for three seconds.
#2738 of 2769 Re: kennynmd's response to "He was a CHP officer" [bilmat]
Feb 09, 2010 (9:51 am)
You could save three seconds by shifting into neutral.
#2739 of 2769 Re: Chipped paint? [Mike]
Feb 09, 2010 (10:31 am)
I have a 1 month old 2010 ES and I have seen at least 2 paint chips.