Last post on Aug 03, 2013 at 1:54 AM
You are in the Mazda3
What is this discussion about?
Mazda MAZDA3, Mazda MAZDASPEED MAZDA3, Fuel Efficiency (MPG)
#99 of 963 Re: heelundtoe - [heelundtoe]
Sep 17, 2005 (5:19 pm)
...if you want better fuel economy, get the stick.
...I think Mazda claims 5th gear is an overdrive, it's more like a true fifth gear.
That may have been true in the past (that MTs get better mileage than ATs), but it's not necessarily true today. A lot depends upon the final drive ratio. A number of Japanese auto manufacturers give a higher final drive ratio to MTs than ATs, and this would tend to lower the gas mileage of MTs vis-a-vis ATs. They do this because of cruise control: when going up a hill under cruise control, an AT automatically downshifts; an MT will not, and it will seem to the driver of an MT that his car loses power going up a hill. To counter this complaint, the auto manufacturers give the MT a slightly higher final drive ratio than the AT. And because of torque converter lock-up, there is no slippage in torque converters as there was in the (distant) past.
For the Mazda3, the final drive ratio for the MT is reported to be 4.105; for the AT, the final drive ratios bracket the MT value: 3.685 (i-model) and 4.416 (s-model). Based on these values alone, I would predict better gas mileage (at constant highway speeds) to ATs in the s-model, and to MTs in the i-model. (I don't put much faith in EPA estimates.)
Finally, both 4th and 5th gears in the MT are overdrive (output shaft spins faster than the input shaft) although 4th gear is almost (but not quite) 1:1. But 5th gear is very much an overdrive; the 5th gear ratio is 0.755:1.
I almost bought a Mazda3 this summer. My family was down to one car and I desperately needed something fast. I test drove a Mazda3 and liked it, but in July in my area there was very little to choose from, and I had no idea when the 2006 Mazdas would arrive. I eventually bought another 2005 Japanese car at a good end-of-model year price.
My principal hesitation about Mazda is that the company is majority owned by Ford (at 33% ownership, Ford is the principal stockholder). The two Mazda engines are derived from the Ford Duratec. I think Ford, like GM, cannot put as much money into R&D as the independent Japanese companies, due to their high union wages and medical benefits paid to their employees and their enormous commitment (pension and medical) to their retirees. I would hate to see 1/3 of my money going to Ford.
A second point of concern is that Mazda does not have a wide dealer network in the part of the country where I live.
#100 of 963 Re: Ford ownership by gly
Sep 18, 2005 (9:06 am)
Interesting. A few questions for you, gly.
I eventually bought another 2005 Japanese car a 2005 Honda Accord?
Mazda ... is majority owned by Ford ... The two Mazda engines are derived from the Ford Duratec.
Ford also exercises control over Volvo and Jaguar. My understanding is that Mazda reworks the engines to their needs, so for example a Focus and Mazda3 deliver different results.
I think Ford, like GM, cannot put as much money into R&D as the independent Japanese companies, due to their high union wages and medical benefits paid to their employees and their enormous commitment (pension and medical) to their retirees. I would hate to see 1/3 of my money going to Ford.
My understanding is that the Asian brands, like Toyota and Honda, offer similar wages and benefits to their employees in order to match union settlements. This is the case in Canada but I'm not sure if this is true for the US also. I share your concern about Ford and GM but hope the real problem is solved, product lineup, and not have the blame shifted.
Mazda does not have a wide dealer network ... where I live.
Where is that?
#102 of 963 Re: heelundtoe - [gly]
Sep 19, 2005 (5:24 am)
The two Mazda engines are derived from the Ford Duratec.
Maybe a little more research would've changed your mind. Here's the truth, from a Mazda tech website:
In 2004, Ford dropped the development of the 4-cylinder Zetec engine in favor of Mazda's MZR 4-cylinder. Thus, 2005+ Duratec 4 cylinder engines are Mazdas. This includes the 2.0 liter Duratec 20 and 2.3 liter Duratec 23.
The Duratec 23 is a 2.3 L (2261 cc) version of the Mazda-designed Duratec 20. Bore is 87.4 mm and stroke is 94 mm. It has an aluminum engine block with cast iron cylinder liners and aluminum DOHC cylinder heads. It uses SFI fuel injection, has 4 valves per cylinder with VCT and features fracture-split forged powder metal connecting rods and a one-piece cast camshaft.
The 2.0L and 2.3L Mazda3 engines are called Duratecs (in Ford products; they're called ZZRs in Mazda products) -- but they're designed and built by Mazda for Mazda and Ford applications.
#103 of 963 Re: heelundtoe - [mdaffron]
Sep 19, 2005 (6:19 am)
Right on the money again. The Duratec 23 was a joint collaboration between Mazda/Ford just as the Tribute/Escape. In other words, a Mazda team from Japan and a Ford team from Detroit butted heads. And just as in the Tribute/Escape, Mazda took the lead in the whole project to replace not only their own 2.0 (Protégé), but also the Ford Zetec with more environmentally friendly (if not more powerful) engines; in fact, they were solely in charge of setting up (charges were shared) the mfg. plant to produce these engines (range, if I remember correctly, was from 1.6 to 2.3 with the potential to go even higher to a 5 in-line).
#104 of 963 Re: sandman46 - Brake dust [z71bill] by mdaffron [z71bill]
Sep 22, 2005 (8:37 pm)
Well, this is a late response to your question about the rear pads, but my 04 mazda 3 with only 3750 miles has thrown off a lot of brake dust in the rear. It is now at the dealer, who, unsurprisingly said that it met specs. But this is very unusual because we all know that the front pads are always the problem before the rear. He is keeping it overnight to see some more tomorrow. I saw some postings a while back from other owners about this.
BTW, I am lucky to get 25 MPG so far. Mostly hwy with an auto tranny. It is definitely a fun car, and I chose it for impractical reasons!
#105 of 963 Re: sandman46 - Brake dust [z71bill] by mdaffron [z71bill] [kbinsb]
Sep 23, 2005 (9:21 am)
I don't understand this obsession with the brake dust. I have a friend who owns a Infinity g-35 and the previous owner of the company i work for recently purchased one of the new beemers and both those cars have just as much or if not more brake dust on their alloy wheels than my 3s. I don't necessarily see this as a problem as other cars in a "premium class" exhibit the same?
the only problem i see is it is annoying to constantly have to clean the alloy wheels
Sep 23, 2005 (9:43 am)
The dust on the rear wheels - although a pain to clean is not the problem - it is the rapid wear of the rear brake pads. I rotated my tires a few days ago - the rear pads are wearing out much faster than the front. I guess that my rear pads will need to be replaced (plus the rear rotors) by the time I hit 20K miles.
Does replacing rear pads at 20K seem normal?
Sep 24, 2005 (6:50 am)
The wearing down of the rear pads is also a main concern for me to. We've never had a car with 4 whell discs before, so I don't know if this is normal or not. It would be nice to have all the brake pads wear at the similar pace or close to it.
It looks like I will be inheriting the car soon as the wife can't see to well on the right side of the car...she's already had 3 near misses and wants to go with me to the South Florida Auto Show next month to find another car. Any car with low head rests and compact size is what she's looking for. Any suggestions? I offered to swap my '03 Sentra with her, as the vision is great, but she wants a car with more power.
#108 of 963 Left in the dust [z71bill]
Sep 24, 2005 (4:11 pm)
Does replacing rear pads at 20K seem normal?
No and No. Firstly, 20K seems premature wear. Secondly, on a front wheel drive shouldn't most of the braking be happening with the front discs? I would expect the fronts to wear out first.
By way of comparison, my 2002 Mazda Protege5 (also equipped with 4 discs) has exceeded 37K miles (60K km) on the original brakes; I'm hoping they reach 45K miles. I was advised by a Mazda service rep to get brakes lubed annually to ensure they don't bind. I did had that service once but I likely won't do it annually.