Last post on Oct 21, 2013 at 11:49 AM
You are in the Honda Pilot
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Honda Pilot, Fuel Efficiency (MPG), SUV
#791 of 1186 Re: Shift at over 3,000 RPM's???? [spacedog]
Mar 25, 2008 (6:54 am)
Hopefully enough complaints will prompt Honda to do some research into this issue.
My neighbor has an 07 Ridgeline, and we drive about the same style. He averages about the same mileage (maybe a little better) in local driving as our 03 Pilot.
I asked him about the shift points (RPM) with a warm engine, and he said he didn't know, but would check it out. He got back with me and said, that when the engine is cold and a very light foot, it shifts around 2800 RPM. With a warm engine, on level ground and light foot, it shifts at 1800-2000 RPM. Same with our Pilot on both counts.
One of our sons recently traded his Mustang GT for an 07 Ridgeline. He says he is getting 17-19 local driving, but hasn't paid attention to shifting points.
Several people have posted on this forum, excellent mileage with newer Pilots.
This indicates that the large mileage differences are not a "Gearing" thing. But something else!
With those Pilots that shift at higher RPM, is it possible that something in the "logic" is not "Understanding" that the engine is warm? If that is the case, the engine could also be continuously running richer, as though it not warmed up to operating temps yet. This may not even show up as an error in the computer.
Below is a copy of neighbors spread sheet. A couple of items to NOTE:
1. He normally sets his cruise on 75mph. The fillup on 10/28/07 was the result of setting the cruise on 65 mph for that one 256 mile trip, "just to see what it would do", according to him. Again, it resulted in about the same mileage as our Pilot at that speed.
2. The last fillup on 03/16/08 was the result of 273 miles. 155 miles of that was towing a 3200# Trail Manor (collapsible) camper and the rest was local.
Date Odometer $/gal Gallons Cost Mileage Avg
8/13/2007 299 $2.579 14.93 $38.51 18.01 18.01
8/22/2007 424 $2.649 7.74 $20.50 16.15 17.38
8/22/2007 562 $2.619 6.61 $17.30 20.89 18.17
8/22/2007 742 $2.529 8.90 $22.50 20.23 18.65
8/23/2007 961 $2.649 10.76 $28.50 20.36 19.03
9/3/2007 1196 $2.549 12.79 $32.60 18.37 18.89
9/24/2007 1507 $2.629 17.50 $46.00 17.77 18.64
9/30/2007 1619 $2.629 6.09 $16.01 18.39 18.63
10/12/2007 1775 $2.549 7.45 $19.00 20.93 18.81
10/12/2007 1871 $2.599 4.58 $11.91 20.95 18.91
10/16/2007 1971 $2.519 4.45 $11.20 22.49 19.07
10/18/2007 2075 $2.699 4.63 $12.49 22.47 19.22
10/18/2007 2372 $2.599 12.50 $32.50 23.75 19.69
10/26/2007 2582 $2.589 9.35 $24.20 22.47 19.90
10/28/2007 2838 $2.719 9.64 $26.21 26.56 20.36
11/2/2007 3136 $2.589 13.75 $35.60 21.67 20.48
11/2/2007 3406 $2.589 11.59 $30.00 23.30 20.68
11/15/2007 3673 $2.839 13.70 $38.90 19.49 20.59
11/23/2007 3743 $2.839 4.93 $14.00 14.20 20.41
12/2/2007 3829 $2.879 4.52 $13.00 19.05 20.38
12/5/2007 3878 $2.869 2.37 $6.80 20.67 20.38
12/11/2007 3969 $2.819 4.82 $13.60 18.86 20.35
12/27/2007 4289 $2.789 16.13 $45.00 19.83 20.31
1/9/2008 4436 $2.959 8.28 $24.50 17.75 20.21
1/20/2008 4557 $2.919 7.78 $22.70 15.56 20.05
2/12/2008 4783 $2.869 13.50 $38.73 16.74 19.86
3/16/2008 5056 $3.099 17.59 $54.50 15.52 19.57
#792 of 1186 Re: Shift at over 3,000 RPM's???? [spacedog]
Mar 25, 2008 (7:38 am)
That is exactly what I have been saying. Our 2004 Odyssey shifts at a much, much lower rpm for a given speed and throttle pressure. I have notified the dealer but since I don't put many miles on the 2007 Pilot (only one oil change in 16 months, 11,000 miles currently) I don't get to talk to them much. I WILL mention it again at my next service, though!
I don't believe that the transmission shift points are effecting my HIGHWAY mileage at all. I know that the TC stays locked so that should not be an issue, however since the gear ratios are different between the 2004 and 2007, there must be an overall effect (however that may be minimal).
What some of us have been saying is that OUR Pilots are not delivering the fuel economy that YOURS is. Tess and Slamtaz, This has nothing to do with my foot or driving style. It doesn't matter if you set the cruise control on my Pilot or if I set it, the vehicle will be moving at a constant speed (and on flat ground) and it will not get the gas mileage that your Pilot gets. That has been my point for quite a while, my Pilot is not delivering as expected nor as good as some other Pilots. Please don't take this response the wrong way, I appreciate all of your input and comments but please consider the fact that some Pilots just don't get good gas mileage.
I have stated before that with so many components that must work together in a vehicle, a few can combine to effect performance or efficiency. I just wish I could figure out what and/or why I don't get better gas mileage.
That Buick Enclave is rated for 22 mpg on the highway, but they were able to get 27 mpg with the cruise control set with that six-speed transmission. I have always been able to exceed the rated mpg in all my vehicles and yet I can barely get the rated mpg in my Pilot
#793 of 1186 Re: Shift at over 3,000 RPM's???? [spacedog]
Mar 25, 2008 (12:25 pm)
I haven't had a chance to take our Pilot into the shop but am going to this weekend. The dealer offered to let me test drive another model while mine was being checked out to see if I notice a difference. Although I appreciate the gesture, it just sounds like they want to keep me busy instead of actually checking the engine for me. I'll let everyone know how the other model handles, if any differently.
We actually just took it on our first long road trip of roughly 400 miles. I don't have an exact measurement of our mpg, but hope to get one finished soon. I tried to keep it in cruise as much as possible right around 72 or 73. I also don't feel the need to speed as much as I used to because the ride is more comfortable, quite, safer feeling, smoother, etc... I'm "one of the big guys" on the road now I used to drive a little Toyota Corolla.
I didn't notice the gear switching issue from 4th to 5th though. It did seem to rev high when it changed over right around 65 mph, but otherwise it seemed fine. I'll take this other Pilot out on the interstate and really open it up this weekend. Hope to have something good for everyone. Thanks.
#794 of 1186 Re: Shift at over 3,000 RPM's???? [justaveragejoe]
Mar 25, 2008 (1:03 pm)
please consider the fact that some Pilots just don't get good gas mileage.
Exactly, because not all model year Pilots are created equal. Also true that not all drivers are created equal. Pilot owners have different driving styles. City/highway mix is another factor. Etc. But the basic starting point is that not all Pilots are created
#795 of 1186 Re: Shift at over 3,000 RPM's???? [davidd3]
Mar 25, 2008 (6:13 pm)
David, et al,
You are exactly right, but here is my beef... I had an 04 EX-L 4WD and drove it for 4 years. Loved everything about it. Lease ended and decided to get the same vehicle 08 EX-L 4WD in Jan. I believe the 04 and 08 should be similar but not exactly the same. On the 5th model year, you would think the engineers would have it tuned to perfection,....not my experience by a long shot. Gas mileage appears to be much worse in my 08 (so far) I can only surmise that many new pilot owners take all of this high rev shifting, poor gas mileage as normal. I probably would too if I had not driven a pilot for 4 years. Maybe they changed the software in the 08 that does not fit my driving style anymore? If this is the case can somebody please tell me how I must change my driving style in the 08 to get the same gas mileage and performance as the 04?
#797 of 1186 Re: Shift at over 3,000 RPM's???? [spacedog]
Mar 26, 2008 (9:34 am)
On the 5th model year, you would think the engineers would have it tuned to perfection,....not my experience by a long shot. Gas mileage appears to be much worse in my 08
Everyone who comes to realize this finds it surprising. Maybe Honda engineers have, in this instance, improved performance at the cost of fuel efficiency.
I can only surmise that many new pilot owners take all of this high rev shifting, poor gas mileage as normal. I probably would too if I had not driven a pilot for 4 years.
I have a 2007 EXL 4WD. Same as the 2008 in this respect. I've considered the high revving to be normal, since many other people have reported it in this forum. But I am interested to see where this discussion is going, in particular some forum contributors taking up this issue with Honda as possibly being a defect.
Mar 26, 2008 (2:23 pm)
03 Pilot with 60k on it. A lot of factors contribute to the mpg of your vehicle. Type of tires you have, Tire pressure, Winter bend fuel vs summer bend for cold climates. How often the vehicle is using 4 wheel drive, Mechanical condition. One other thing to consider is what type of gas you purchase. From my own tests in my opinion it seems to make a difference. Discount gas or top tier gas. Better fuel, better mileage.
I average 17 in town and 22 on the hwy. In the winter I get a mile or two less when it's very cold and in the summer a mile or two more.
#799 of 1186 Re: Mpg factors [minnesnowta1]
Mar 26, 2008 (4:01 pm)
You don't mean top tier being premium gas ? Or do you mean discount gas being non Shell/Mobil/BP, etc name brands ? Because premium gas will not make a difference unless you are towing heavy loads. Otherwise, on regular driving, use regular gas - 87 octane and money spent on premium is a total waste.
#800 of 1186 Re: Model Year 04-08 Specs [justaveragejoe]
Mar 26, 2008 (8:09 pm)
I'm no guru when it comes to figuring out how, why or what specifically affects mileage and up to what extent, although i'm quite aware of the following to affect mileage in a certain way:
1. up to about 260 lbs curb weight difference from the base model 2WD VP to the 4WD EXL/SE models.
2. regular load on the vehicle (i.e. passengers, baggages, running/step boards, extras, etc.)
3. tire pressure & over-all vehicle maintenance
4. how the vehicle was broken-in by the owner and to include the time it's sitting on the dealer's lot(i.e. this is also why i prefer to get fresh-off-the-truck vehicles, as i don't know how those vehicles sitting on the lot were test driven by other customers, if i may say, there are those who trash vehicles during test drives and even push it to the limits).
5. driving style
6. driving environment including terrain type, wind factor, weather temp, road quality, etc.
i also tend to agree that the sum of the individual parts (i.e. which may vary in individual quality) may perform a bit differently together and could explain the apparent difference in mileage or performance or even having a .
i used to have a 1988 pathfinder (yes 1988, not a typo) which i was surprised that the dealer offer to take as a trade-in when i got our pilot. mileage on the 3.0 Ltr 4WD V6 pathfinder was a measly 13.5 to 14.0 mpg city and 15 to 16.5 mpg hiway . that's why before purchasing the 3.5 Ltr pilot, even just getting a few notches +/- the EPA mpg of 16/22 city/hiway was good enough for me.
just my .02