Last post on May 27, 2009 at 4:34 PM
You are in the Ford Mustang
What is this discussion about?
Ford Mustang, Pontiac GTO, Coupe, Convertible
#289 of 2056 Re: Why are we having the IRS discussion [dieselone]
Apr 23, 2005 (11:30 am)
Dieselone writes.......This debate will be over in year or two anyway when the current imposter GTO is either dropped or replaced by a car worthy of the GTO name. ......
Since when is the current GTO an impostor or not worthy of the GTO name? LOL!? What do you think the original 1964 GTO was? it was a performance OPTION on the 1964 Pontiac Lemans A body 2 dr coupe with a big V8. LOL! 40yrs later GM borrows a car from it's holden division and does same thing, midsized 2 door coupe with a big 6 liter V8. Same thing. BTW....the 2005 GTO is the FASTEST MOST POWERFULL GTO ever MADE!! No GTO ever offered 400hp from factory. I think highest was 370hp on the 1969 Judge. Remember those ratings are PRE SAE, so you really have to take about 20% away from them.
If you want to go that route we could argue that the 1974 GTO, the SLOWEST production GTO ever made was a rebadge and not worthy of the GTO name on it's Pontiac Ventura ala Chevy Nova chassis. 9.4 seconds time! It was still a GTO.
Or we could argue that the NEW Mustang is NOT a real mustang because it was based off the 2000 Lincoln LS chassis, Tbird, Jag S chassis, right? Big upgrade over the old 27 yr old Fox 1978 Chassis. But I consider it to be a real mustang.
#290 of 2056 Re: FR500C/GT500 vs. GTO-R [benderofbows]
Apr 23, 2005 (11:33 am)
Man, you are like a pitbull. You never let go. You twist my words, misquote me, and now you have come up with the most ridiculous conclusions that have absolutely nothing to do with anything I have said. Try to get it right this time. I don't like the new GT500 (although after having read some old reviews, the new one will severly outperform the old one). If you want to defend it, fine, but don't go putting words in my mouth. I am going to try and help you with your problem. So work with me. First, relax. Close your eyes and breathe deeply. Now repeat after me: Let it be, Let it be, Let it be.
#291 of 2056 OK - knock it off
Apr 23, 2005 (11:36 am)
Alright - agree to disagree and move on. Let's not get into personal blows here.
#292 of 2056 perceptions are different
Apr 23, 2005 (1:00 pm)
I woudln't classify either the Mustang nor the GTO having a ride similar to any Mercedes I've ever driven.
Probably the best handling/ride trade-off I've ever experienced was in a BMW 3 series I owned (it had all sorts of other issues that would preclude me from buying another, though).
From an evolution stand point, trying to compare cars from their forefathers, from any generation, is really an excercise in futility. So many things have changed over the decades.
I have mentioned that my sister has a '65 Mustang with a 289. It's also a manual tranny. Driving mine and driving hers is more akin to hers being similar to driving a bus compared to driving mine. Technology and engineering have changed so much over the last 4 decades.
Same would be true of driving a '60s era GTO when compared to a current one.
A '60s era Shelby wouldn't be any picnic to drive either.
Cars from that era (in comparison to any current car) would have sloppy steering, crude and unrefined suspensions, brakes that could be compared to a Flintstone mobile.
When I was a tyke, I remember my father allowing me to drive his '70s era Chrysler New Yorker up and down roads on a farm he owned. The thing had a big 440 V8 with a big 4 bbl carb. I remember tromping it. It would squat down when the 2 extra barrels opened up and would blast off. It had NO steering feel. It seemed like every time I hit the brakes, they transitioned from no braking, to locking up.....with nothing in between. Had to turn the steering wheel 3-4 inches before anything would happen. My memory of those experiences tells me I'd have a hard time keeping that monster on the road today.
How people kept any of those '60s era cars on the road, when the speed limit was 75 MPH on ALL interstates is a mystery to me. Guess it had more to do with what you were used to.
#293 of 2056 Friends shouldn't let friends drink & type
Apr 23, 2005 (2:33 pm)
I got a few feathers ruffled. I re-read my post today and I came across harder than I intended to. The long necks where going down smooth last night and I was getting sick of seeing all of the IRS posts so I lashed out more harshly than I normally would.
I will stick to my belief that GM should have done something different besides rebadging the Murano, the GTO faithful on this board may disagree, but that is how I feel.
Yes, no doubt about the current GTO's performance, I never have or will dispute that point. The car is on the heavy side, but it seems to have enough power & suspension to compensate.
I guess I can't get over the fact that GM basically used the Murano as a fill-in until something home grown could be developed. I've looked at Holden's website and the GTO is so similar in looks it's frightning, inside and out.
Other than convert it to a left hand drive model, stuff the vette motor in it, and slap on a Pontiac front end, what did GM design on this car? I'm not being sarcastic, I'm seriously asking 'cause I don't know.
#294 of 2056 Re: Hey, I owned a Nova... [gunit]
Apr 23, 2005 (3:09 pm)
That white one is really nice looking. I especially like the Pontiac rims. Are those Centerlines on the brown one? I don't think I would put Centerlines on a '74 anything. There was also a '74 RoadRunner that was probably the weakest RoadRunner. But considering this was the year after the first gas shortage, they were not bad car. And it wasn't just that gas doubled in price, you literally couldn't get it at times. So any kind of performance was a good thing. thanks for the post
#295 of 2056 Re: perceptions are different [graphicguy]
Apr 23, 2005 (4:25 pm)
The GTO is the closest American car that I have ever owned that came close to the BMW 528 I had in terms of ride/handling. Esp the same feeling when you put the GTO into Drive and the back end sinks a little, my 528 did same thing! For better traction. My 528 was great, dumped it around 160k miles. Just wanted something newer/less miles. Ran great.
My 1958 Chevy which has manual steering, manual brakes and a 3spd manual on the column, boy does that have a hard clutch/shift feel to it. Very hard to turn wheel when nearly stopped, good upper arm workout, LOL! The V8 in it more then keeps up with modern traffic. Yes you can turn the wheel 2 inches + before it starts to turn, LOL! Braking from the 4 drums is actually decent. Not as good as modern car. Really have to hit brakes, "Manual" The ride is actually quite nice.. soaks up bumps quite well, and huge trunk-backseat. Handling is horrendous. The best corners that car handles are at a 4 way stop sign, LOL! That cars gives me a good upper and lowe workout after driving.
#296 of 2056 Re: Friends shouldn't let friends drink & type [dieselone]
Apr 23, 2005 (4:43 pm)
If GM didn't use the Monaro from their Holden company, then right now we would have NOTHING rear drive and V8, Except expensive Vette/CTS-V and the same lame Front wheel drive V6 cars. I can't fully complain. GM's NOT advertising the GTO didn't help either, LOL! They sure spent Milliions on Grand Prix/G6 advertising. Yeah the GTO is near identical to the Monaro but that isn't a bad thing to me. It could be worse, they could have made GTO a front drive V6 car, LOL!
For 2007 GM was supposed to have an all new GTO as well as other midsized rear drive cars based on the rear drive ZETA platform which was just cancelled cited as too costly. Not sure what will be done for 2007 if anything! 2006 might be it for the GTO.
Look at the Grand Prix, only a 4 door sedan today. Real Grand prixes were always 2 door & rear drive from 1962 to 1988
#297 of 2056 Re: Friends shouldn't let friends drink & type [dieselone]
Apr 23, 2005 (4:46 pm)
"what did GM design on the car?" Good question and the answer is: nothing. That's why we like it. The reason the GTO is similar in looks to a Holden is because it is a Holden. Monaro that is. There is nothing wrong with that except that they rushed it to market and probably should have worked out some of the bugs first. The GTO is on the heavy side and personally I like that.
#298 of 2056 Re: Friends shouldn't let friends drink & type [sputterguy]
Apr 23, 2005 (4:50 pm)
The Holden Monaro debuted as a NEW 2002 car in late 2001 in Austrailia. Otherwise I 100% agree with you about the car. .Also the interior on the Monaro/GTO is the BEST that GM has put in a car in years. Better then new Vettes. Same or better then Caddies CTS-V as per Consumer Reports. Even they were amazed at the interior. C&D liked INterior as well. My GTP Grand Prix interior and F body interiors was GARBAGE in comparison to GTO. Same with The switchgear control is the best I have ever seen in a GM vehicle as well. The hazzard 4way switch is where is should be, not on top of the steering column. Yes the GTO is nearly 3750 lbs heavy, but I like that too. It rides like more of a luxury car then a Pony car/F body car. Firm ride but good.