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Hatchbacks Mazda3 Mazdaspeed3 vs. VW V GTI vs. Civic Si
1379 messages, Last post on Oct 01, 2009 at 10:54 AM
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Replying to: aviboy97 (Aug 14, 2007 7:14 am) Wrong! The '98 Passat & '99 Jetta all rode so comfortably not even the '07 Accord can match. Consumer Reports also feels that the current MkV Jetta/Rabbit rides no more comfortably than the old '99 MkIV Jetta/Golf. B/c when I test drove the '99 Jetta, I noticed it's MSRP is lower than the less-comfy-riding '99 Avalon.
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Replying to: eldaino (Aug 14, 2007 10:15 am)
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Replying to: creakid1 (Aug 14, 2007 11:25 am) Wrong! First off, ride quality is subjective, and the 99 Jetta never rode anywhere near the comfort that I have when I am in my fathers 03 Accord. Consumer Reports also feels that the current MkV Jetta/Rabbit rides no more comfortably than the old '99 MkIV Jetta/Golf. Well, it better! It's a new design!! The MkIV ride was not all that great! B/c when I test drove the '99 Jetta, I noticed it's MSRP is lower than the less-comfy-riding '99 Avalon. Two totally different vehicles. The Jetta is a compact/mid sized vehicle, and the Avalon is a full sized sedan. If the Jetta was more expensive, it would have been a total rip off. The Jetta better compares to the Corolla, rather then the Avalon. |
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Replying to: aviboy97 (Aug 14, 2007 12:38 pm) Good point. & to be reasonable, I did noticed that the '99 Jetta riding less than perfect -- sometimes slightly lumpy & sometimes slightly floaty. But the '95-99 (I never rode the '00 or newer) Avalon had quicker up-&-down motions over larger bumps & therefore didn't glide as well as the Jetta in a relaxing manner, at least when I sat in the back seat. "Well, it better! It's a new design!! The MkIV ride was not all that great!" Consumer Reports also has the tendency to notice the ride smoothness over the superficial road surface quite a bit rather than just larger bumps. That's most likely why they somewhat prefer the ride of the previous generation Passat/Jetta over the current ones. But now w/ Control Blades' better ride/handling compromise that made the cars "too" close to perfection, VW probably purposely made the ride a little coarse so buyers will spend more $ to get the Audi A6 instead. Consumer Reports also rates the steering feel not during the handling limit. That's why they found more steering feel in the MkV GTI than in the Civic Si. Ditto the G35 over the 325i. But other magazines pointed out that it's the other way around when these cars are being pushed to limit! I've been arguing w/ my relatives that VW's are great b/c they ride better than Japanese cars. & they hate VW's due to the nightmares they had w/ the two 1st-yr MkII Jetta's long time ago. But one of my cousins just returned the Passat after his 3-yr lease, then the next lease -- an '07 Accord -- only drew criticizms from his family member about the ride comfort, turning radius, can't see over the hood... Again, bulkier but still less comfy than the VW. The Euro Civic may be great on the track, & in many cases, beating the GTI, C-1 Focus, Mazdaspeed3, etc., but that's only when they didn't care about the ride.
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Replying to: thegraduate (Aug 14, 2007 11:30 am) 
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Replying to: creakid1 (Aug 14, 2007 8:28 pm) totally agree. but i do think the steering wheel itself is a bit nicer on the gti.  The Euro Civic may be great on the track, & in many cases, beating the GTI, C-1 Focus, Mazdaspeed3, etc., but that's only when they didn't care about the ride. i've read that the regular euro civic rides great, if not as uber comfy as the mkV. Its when it comes to bumps that its nothing to write home about. same as the type r, but to a more noticable extent.
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Replying to: creakid1 (Aug 14, 2007 8:28 pm) When it comes to reviews on vehicles, I do not hold CR all that high. I prefer to read Road and Track or Motor Trend for their opinion on how the car performs. Better yet, I like to see for myself. The only thing I find CR good for is long term reliability reports. They are fairly accurate in that respect. |
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Don't bother with the mags and do your own driving. No matter what people say, I couldn't live with boyracer feel of the Si or MS3. The lack of power in the Si, skateboard ride and bargain basement interior didn't hit for me but no reviews mention these things. Likewise, the busy ride of the MS3, the buzzy exhaust and the horrid clutch/gearing aren't brought up in reviews of the fast Mazda. Drive the cars on your own and totally ignore the mags. They offer nothing of value.
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Replying to: eldaino (Aug 15, 2007 6:33 am) the regular euro civic rides great? That was my point -- no way! Regular versions don't have lowered suspension, & the dyamics of this Euro-spec will be handicapped badly by its low-tech suspension. OK, take a look at this interesting Autoexpress 4-car comparison. Low-tech suspension made it trumped in trunk space, which also made it trumped in...: http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/grouptests/204821/honda_civic.html "The precise pedals and steering are light enough to be easy to use around town, but also prove impressively responsive. That bodes well for the car’s driver appeal, and on the whole the Honda lives up to expectations. It’s grippy and well balanced, although it doesn’t tackle corners with the same panache as the Focus. Ride comfort is entirely acceptable, but all three rivals excel in that area, and the Civic comes across as rather sporting in comparison, with the dampers failing to fully isolate rough road surfaces." Best driver's car in the 61-hatch comparison test: http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/grouptests/204822/ford_focus.html "The suspension is so well oiled, gliding over surfaces where its rivals, even the Auris (new Corolla), fidget and fight. It takes the sting out of rough roads, is never caught off-balance and carves through corners cleanly and effortlessly. In terms of driver appeal, the Focus is by far the most polished and involving car in this test – and that’s true of every single model in the 61-strong hatchback range." Comfort is priority: http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/grouptests/204823/volkswagen_golf.html "The Golf doesn’t relish being hurried. It has a more laid back character than the zesty Civic, and is at its best when cruising at high speed. On motorways, very little wind noise penetrates the cabin. But on bumpy roads, the softer suspension means there’s more roll and wallow. In short, the VW isn’t as well controlled as its rivals here, and feels slightly lethargic. It turns in accurately enough, and the speed-sensitive steering is well weighted, but compared to the Ford it’s not a particularly engaging car to drive." Redesigned but still behind in "driving technology": http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/grouptests/204820/toyota_auris.html "The stiff bodyshell has enabled the company to make the most of the new suspension set-up. Initially, it seems firm – roll is minimal through corners and the whole car is tightly controlled. As a result, the Auris is rarely caught out, and that means it’s reassuring to drive. It can’t match the Focus’s sparkling chassis and soothing road manners, despite being equipped with Toyota’s most positive gearshift since the Celica and offering very well weighted steering. But the new hatch is a big step forward nevertheless. Yet although the Auris will be welcomed by undemanding drivers, it’s flawed. The steering is uninformative, the A-pillars are intrusive and it weaves under hard braking, with the pedal soon becoming mushy underfoot." Looks like this Brit magazine thinks that buyers of econo boxes are cheapskates & should pick the Civic as 1st place due to the biggest engine's max pwr but w/ best fuel economy & interior/trunk room. Since we care about driving experience more, you should do your own ranking: http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/grouptests/204819/family_hatchbacks.html- - - - - - - - - - - "Each rival here tested the newcomer in a particular area – the Honda Civic has unrivalled design and packaging, the Ford Focus the best ride and handling, while no other hatch is as well built or classy as the VW Golf. The Auris was found wanting in each department." So these Control Blades in the (C-1) Focus can easily "slice up" Euro Civic's (& the new Euro Corolla's) cheap suspension in both the ride AND the handling departments. Why would you tolerate a worse ride while the handling is not exactly better? |
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| That "61-strong hatchback range" actually means that there are 61 different Focus hatch, not 61 different kinds of cars. My bad. | |
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