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Hatchbacks Mazda3 Mazdaspeed3 vs. VW V GTI vs. Civic Si
1379 messages, Last post on Oct 01, 2009 at 10:54 AM
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Replying to: eldaino (Aug 09, 2007 6:36 am) |
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Add a lag-free supercharger to the 1.4 turbo can do no less while less fuel/emission is needed: http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/longtermtests/209883/volkswagen_golf.htm- - - - - - - - l This engine is finally coming to America along w/ the new body: http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/spyshots/209759/volkswagen_golf.html The bulky, heavy, weak low-end, gritty-sounding & thirsty 2.5 5-cyl is finally dead. So the output of your next std Rabbit can be tuned to "Edition 30" level? & everyone of them can now ride on DSG. I wonder what's gonna happen to the 4-link Control Blade rear suspension when they simplify it this time.
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Replying to: creakid1 (Aug 10, 2007 7:56 am) which ones? all the recent ones i have read are NOT talking about the jdm type r (the sedan you mentioned) but about the torsion-beamed hatch that is exclusive to them. (europe.) i think the type r from japan would fare horrible in europe, its suspension is tuned way to much for track use to be a daily driver for most.
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Replying to: creakid1 (Aug 10, 2007 6:31 pm) man! weak low end? what are you talking about!? thats the problem with the 2.5: its MOSTLY low end! I dunno about the rabbit being tuned to edition 30 levels...where on this report does it say that? and i didn't see where they said they would simplify the control blades...they are just tweaking them. and granted, this is a uk website: the 2.5 engine is nonexistant there, so we don't know what vw of america has in store for us yet, even though i wouldn't mind some different engine choices. I just hope the base price doesn't go up, the interior retains its luxury (thoug i feel that this is going to be the first thing to go, it'll still be nice, about as nice as mazda or honda, but it may not be slightly superior like it is now. And they better keep the rabbit nameplate!) i didn't find any real proof or insinuation that the 1.4 is coming to the US. IT may make the gti irrelevant! to top it off, the mk VI looks only very slightly different than the mkV; and its hard to tell with all the coverings. But i only detect slight refreshings of the body, a bit more muscular. the biggest changes will be under the hood and in how its produced.
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Replying to: eldaino (Aug 12, 2007 2:22 pm) |
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Replying to: eldaino (Aug 12, 2007 2:30 pm) My bad. I only read about the difference b/t VW's 2.3 5-cyl & 1.8 4-cyl turbo from British "CAR" when the V5 was first available more than a few years ago. They said the V5 doesn't cost less, has weaker low-end torque but no more pk hp, consumes more fuel & the nature of the 5-cyl also sounds less smooth. So the only reason they can think of for this V5 to exist is that the 1.8 turbo's continueous max-torque produces a constant accelerating rate along w/ a non-music-like unchanging sound throughout the rev range. This is simply boring & therefore feels less satisfying than an engine w/ rise-&-fall torque curve that give you a sweet spot. In other words, the 1.8 turbo is less challenging & therefore less "fun" in a way. http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/firstdrives/59942/volkswagen_golf.html "The result is 168bhp - about the same as the old 2.3-litre V5." There's no doubt that the 2.5 has much more low end than the 2.3, as both have similar max peak hp. Just like the 2.8 in my BMW 328is has about the same peak hp as the weaker-low-end 2.5 in the 325i. But, compare the low0end of the 2.5 5-cyl to this mighty "tractor"- "big-rig"- "locomotive"-like double-charged 4-cyl monster... I don't know: http://www.motorbar.co.uk/vwgolf14gt.htm "When you look at the 'paper' specification and performance figures for VW's new 1.4-litre TSI dual-charged petrol engine and see it is more powerful, faster, more fuel efficient and less polluting than the relatively-new 2.0-litre FSI direct injection petrol engine, it's hard to believe what you're reading can be possible. But, I can assure you, it most certainly is. At last, a petrol engine which drives like a diesel but is quieter although not yet quite as frugal with fuel. Turn the ignition key and the new 1.4-litre unit springs into life — no diesel rattle or clatter. Slip it into first gear and accelerate. Change up to second, third, fourth and so on and there is a huge amount of power. And, more importantly, torque — making the car easy to drive at slow speeds in town or in traffic. On the open road, thanks to supercharger and turbocharger power or a mixing of both, the engine is really responsive and strong during acceleration. There are no steps between these boosted stages. It is a petrol unit, but it's just like driving a diesel. Remarkable." "I dunno about the rabbit being tuned to edition 30 levels...where on this report does it say that?" http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/firstdrives/59942/volkswagen_golf.html "Installed in the new Golf GT, it gives 0-60mph in less than eight seconds, plus 39.2mpg economy and impressive CO2 emissions of 173g/km. But headline figures aside, the most striking aspect is the TSI's performance. Put simply, it feels like a large, lusty engine, with lots of punch and power right up to 6,500rpm." http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/longtermtests/209883/volkswagen_golf.htm- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - l "Power has increased to 230bhp – that’s the same as the Edition 30" Well, it's the same 1.4 super-&-turbo. "and i didn't see where they said they would simplify the control blades...they are just tweaking them." It was another British article that mentioned about "simplifying it" for cost-cutting purpose. & the word "tweaking" simply sounds better. We'll see. The Focus has expensive suspension. The Golf/Rabbit MkIV has expensive interior. The MkV had both expensive interior & suspension. & the MkVI is just a cheaper-built of the MkV? Well, at least they said they will improve the steering ("feel" perhaps?). You know, all it takes for the Rabbit to beat the Focus (& rest of the world) is the steering feel & reliability! http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/firstdrives/59942/volkswagen_golf.html "The result is a vehicle that rides and handles well. A Focus is sharper, but Ford doesn't yet have a 'super-turbo' engine. Not even James Bond has one of those." Nah, I'll pass this "James Bond-ish" high-tech engine 'cause the Focus is still a sharper drive, especially when there's an U.S.-only Mazda-developed 2.3 normally-aspirated meaty 4-cyl on tap  Here's why. This high-tech VW engine is far from perfect. Otherwise, BMW's 3.0 6-cyl nearly-lag-free turbo wouldn't be such a big deal: http://www.thecarconnection.com/Auto_News/Daily_Auto_News/Euro_Drive_VWs_Golf_TS- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - I.S173.A11836.html?pg=2 "You have to be very deliberate in your requests for power (a serious bootful of gas is needed to convince the engine of your desire for a rapid increase forward motion) at which point the Golf GT (maybe a future Rabbit for you Yanks?) jumps to its feet takes off like a startled, er, bunny. It's the most on/off engine I've ever encountered, which is ironic when you consider that the whole point of adding a supercharger was to reduce turbo lag and make it feel more urgent." "i didn't find any real proof or insinuation that the 1.4 is coming to the US. IT may make the gti irrelevant!" Well, maybe VW wants to take time to tune the throttle for a few years before introducing it to a big & sensitive/picky market like the U.S. w/o ruining its image again. Same reason why they changed the 2.3 V5 to 2.5 for the U.S. Just remember, even the 2.0 8v in the non-GTI/GLI MkIV also got replaced by the Audi-designed 1.8 20v turbo gradually before the MkV came out. How about this? It'd be fun if I bet you that by the time the MkVI U.S.-spec Rabbit/Jetta comes out, a super-&-turbo 4-cyl will become the std engine. & people won't complain about its non-GTI-like mpg, either 
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thanks for the links! i really wouldn't mind the 1.4 tsi at all, i just didn't know how vw would position it...i hope it will be reliable! the new edmunds article comparing the bmw m3 and some competitors included a gti edition 30...they said it was great and that its going to become the standard engine in the gti when the mkVI comes out, so if thats the case, butting the 1.4 tsi in the rabbit would makes sense. |
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Replying to: fasterthanyou (Jun 16, 2007 5:26 pm) In my experience with VW, they are not lemons, but simply cars with parts that break down semi-regularly.
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Replying to: andres3 (Aug 13, 2007 9:20 am) As a Honda owner who has watched his dad burned by Chrysler twice, I still have to say that making a comment like that sure seems inflammatory, like you are looking for a fight. You won't find it from me, since I dont completely disagree, but c'mon, 1000 lemons from Dodge for every 1 Honda lemon? That's just major exaggeration.
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statistically 7-yr old Japanese cars have as many problems as 4-yr old American cars. Take your pick. If you lease a made-in-Germany Rabbit for 3 yrs, then you might only have to deal w/ around one unscheduled break down, which isn't too bad consider how this little bunny pampers you every single day w/ 1st-class ride comfort & decent quietness all wrapped in an easy-to-park exterior dimension that'll find you parking spaces easily. I don't recall the bulky '95-99 Toyota Avalon w/ low-tech suspension riding this comfortably!
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