Last post on Apr 17, 2005 at 4:25 PM
You are in the Hybrid Vehicles - Archived Discussions
This discussion is ARCHIVED. To reactivate the discussion, post a request in the Lost? Ask the Hybrids Host for directions! discussion.
What is this discussion about?
Hybrid Cars, Fuel Efficiency (MPG)
#734 of 773 Re: What If - Gasoline is $5 a gallon in 2010? [jamil]
by kirstie_h HOST
Apr 15, 2005 (11:07 am)
You've posted in the wrong discussion - this one is about the future of gasoline prices. If this product is illegal, then members on this board can't advise you. If not, I suggest visiting our Aftermarket & Accessories board.
Host, Future Vehicles & Smart Shopper discussions
#735 of 773 Re: Holy Smoke! [lemko]
Apr 15, 2005 (11:33 am)
"...and all the lost equity on SUV's and suburban homes (no one would want to live 40+ miles from work anymore)."
"But imagine the skyrocketing value of a city home! I Yeah, baby, yeah!"
Yeah with gas = $5, fewer people could afford those suburban homes, and there'd be high demand for city homes.
Depending on how much a city home's pricetag skyrocketed, I'd change careers before I moved into the city. It doesn't make sense to earn $70,000 a year, if I'm spending $50,000 a year paying off the mortgage on my new Baltimore home.
#737 of 773 Re: Holy Smoke! [electrictroy]
Apr 15, 2005 (6:15 pm)
gas prices are somewhat higher than they have ever been, but some of us have been there before. i wouldn't put all my eggs in the 'urban windfall' basket. jmo.
#738 of 773 Re: Holy Smoke! [explorerx4]
Apr 15, 2005 (6:28 pm)
i wouldn't put all my eggs in the 'urban windfall' basket.
The Suburbs were born because the urban housing was too expensive for the middle class. The crime is worse in an urban environment. The pollution is worse. I do not see any reason in the world to move into any city in the USA. In the cheapest neigborhood in the downtown San Diego area I just looked at the MLS. You get a 1300 sq. Ft. fixer on a 6000 sq. ft. lot for $550k. Fifteen miles inland you get a 1400 sq ft. house on a quarter acre for $400k. For the difference in the price of housing you can drive a gas hog SUV for 30 years worth of $5 a gallon gas.
#739 of 773 The upside to $5/gallon in the US
Apr 16, 2005 (5:19 am)
Is it just me, or is anybody else out there enjoying the recent gas price increase? I really get a chuckle when I read articles where a reporter interviews some hapless owner of a gas guzzler. In a recent article from detnews they had the following:
On Monday, after plunking down $65.78 to fill it up, she was thinking about a trade-in. "I would love to have a car that wasn't using so much gas,"
She PLUNKED down $65.78. I usually SWIPE the credit card. The picture showed the woman filling up a big black suburban.
Did this person fail science/physics when she was in school? She must have missed the lesson where they said that energy equals MASS times velocity squared divided by two. I am sure she was sleeping when they covered the equation for force ( Force equals MASS time acceleration). Or maybe the person looked back over 30 years and decided that gas prices would suddenly stay at $1.00 a gallon. All those ups and downs were an aberration.
They end the article with:
"In one day I spend like $6 to go to work, and that's when I just go there and back and nowhere else," said Ma, who drives 26 miles each way to his job as a chef in Pontiac. "How can you survive? It's crazy."
The only thing crazy about this is that people buy a vehicle with poor economy when gas prices are low only to be surprised when prices rise.
And of course, we get all the conspiracy theories popping up. I had a person complain the other day that the local stations in town were charging 10 or 15 cents more than a town 200 miles away. Trying to explain that gas prices equal crude oil prices plus transportation plus local market adjustments is useless. I dare not tell them that the purpose of a business is to take the cash out of your pocket so they can put it in the pocket of the shareholders and the CEO.
My apologies to the people that are really getting hurt by high oil prices (truckers for example). Still, the extra $15 a month I pay is well worth watching people go nuts. I cannot wait till prices hit $3, the sparks are going to really fly.
#740 of 773 Re: I found my answer to $5 gasoline [gagrice]
Apr 16, 2005 (5:36 am)
Only 37.5 mpg? I hope the car gets better mileage as it breaks in. My Avalon gets about 28 mpg under the conditions you describe. A co-worker gets 35 with a 4cyl camry. Not sure the TDI is the answer to higher gas prices for everybody. The cost per mile does not appear to be much better than regular gas (our diesel is 10 to 20 cents more than the 87 octane).
Where did you get the info on how green it was? They did not make the list at
Apr 16, 2005 (5:50 am)
...no one would want to live 40+ miles from work anymore...
While I have no doubt that $5 gas would impact all transportation, I don't beleive this is so. As others have pointed out, there are too many factors in that decision. Besides...there is not enough market space near the cityat today's prices...and if demand were to go up, it would get even worse.
For many folks that drive 40 miles to work and have a 15 mpg vehicle, they could switch to a 30 mpg vehicle and reverse most of that increase. 40 miles 15 mpg costs $5.33 at $2. That goes up to $13.30 at $5/gal. Switch to 30 mpg $5/gal, it would go back down to $6.67.
#742 of 773 Re: I found my answer to $5 gasoline [avalon02wh]
Apr 16, 2005 (8:03 am)
Where did you get the info on how green it was? They did not make the list at
It is not on the green list because the EPA & CARB have not tested them with ULSD or biodiesel. According to VW Engineers the TDI PD engine in the Passat will pass all of CARBs 2007 regulations when used with ULSD. Currently it is rated only one step below the Honda Civic Hybrid when Non California high sulfur gas & diesel is used.
Your cynical remarks about people driving large SUVs may have some merit. Most people that are driving new Excursions, Navigators & Hummers could care less about the cost of gas. In the case of my sister & brother-in-law with their 7 children a Suburban was one of the only vehicles they could legally carry their children in. They live 35 miles from Albuquerque with 5 miles of dirt road. They only go to town on Sunday to church and do their weekly shopping. My brother-in-law rides a motorcycle to work at Sandia Labs. I am sure high gas prices will have a big impact if they take a vacation. Or they may have to skip their vacation this year.
If gas was $10 a gallon it would not impact my lifestyle in the least. I feel for those that are not able to buy all these fancy high mileage cars. The people that are waiting on your table or doing your dry cleaning. They are stuck in the old Ford & Chevy tanks that were cast offs from those that have the money to buy a $30k to $50k car. A lot of people in this country are struggling to buy an old used $2000 car. For you to laugh at their plight is rather sick.
Now to the Passat TDI. I did not buy it for the maximum mileage. I bought it for the option of using biodiesel. If gas goes to $5 per gallon which I seriously doubt, biodiesel will become a very viable alternative. It is being processed and sold in Hawaii very close to # 2 diesel in the $3 per gallon range. Modern diesel engines burning B100 biodiesel are far more environmental & economically friendly than any hybrid on the market in the USA.
Lastly we are still a long way from the true cost of gas that peaked in the late 1970s and early 1980s. We will have to go somewhat higher to pass the highs of the early 1980s. In 2004 dollars the price of oil was $80 per barrel in 1979.
If the price of gasoline relative to wages were comparable today to what they were in 1920, we would be paying almost $10 a gallon for gas.
#743 of 773 Are gas prices going down?
Apr 16, 2005 (4:05 pm)
I see that the price of gas in Toledo Ohio has dropped 17 cents in a week. It is now selling for $1.97 - $1.99. The highest price is $2.13 per gallon. Hope the price drop makes it this way soon. Cheapest in San Diego is $2.41 with a whopping high of $2.97. No wonder people were lined up at the Costco today.