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The Future Of The Manual Transmission

9903 messages,  Last post on May 19, 2013 at 6:47 AM

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What is this discussion about? Transmission

Messages Page 931 of 991

#9299 of 9903 Re: - [nippononly] by habitat1

Aug 20, 2012 (3:40 pm)

Replying to: nippononly (Aug 20, 2012 1:07 pm)
I understand that for 2013 they will no longer offer the diesel - thought that was weird.
 
I had not heard that. I was shown an ordering form that indicated the 2012 X5D would be produced until 11/2012 (vs. the gas 2013 models which started shipping in July). From what I've read, BMW is going to be unveiling a new line up of clean diesels at the LA auto show. Sounded like there is going to be at least one, if not two, X5 diesels in 2013. Of the diesels I drove - ML350 Bluetech, Audi Q7 TDI, Touareg TDI, and Cayenne - the X5 felt the most responsive. It would be weird indeed if they discontinued it, now that they are finally catching on in the states.

#9300 of 9903 Re: - [habitat1] by nippononly

Aug 20, 2012 (7:58 pm)

Replying to: habitat1 (Aug 20, 2012 3:28 pm)
I tested everything and within the SUV segment, the driving experiences can be night an day
 
My sister said the same thing, and she also tested everything in the segment with three rows. The BMW is head and shoulders above the rest for handling. Makes me wonder just how horrific driving a GX350 or an ML350 really is....
 
....but not enough to test drive them - they don't offer a manual transmission after all!

#9301 of 9903 Re: - [nippononly] by habitat1

Aug 21, 2012 (4:05 am)

Replying to: nippononly (Aug 20, 2012 7:58 pm)
Interesting that your sister ended up with the X5, given the 3-row requirement. I think about 1 in 100 on the lots has the third row option and, unless we are talking very small pre-teens, it's on Obama's hit list for his anti-torture policy. We decided to keep our MDX, pass it down to our 17 year old daughter and stick with the two row version of the X5. My 14 year old daughter claimed my former 911 had a bigger back seat than the X5's 3rd row, but she grew a few inches in the 16 months since I sold it.
 
The new ML isn't BMW quality steering and handling, but not nearly as bad as the Lexus GX. The Lexus LX was not test driven as it is way too feminine for my tastes. Only missing a flower vase on the dash.
 
In checking out varous Porsche dealer websites, I am surprised that there are even more Cayenne V6 6-speed manuals popping up here and there. A least 3-4 within 300 miles of DC. I think Porsche's redesign of the Cayenne, in which it became much better looking, slightly bigger interior, shed 400+ pounds, etc. has made it the SUV of choice for someone that might consider rowing their own. It weighs nearly 900 lbs less than the X5 and over 1,300 lbs less than the Audi Q7. Audi, in spite of what others have claimed, is both a car and SUV fatso, still. No excuse for an A6 to weigh 4,000+ lbs.
 
Just out of curiosity, what kind of city/highway gas mileage does your sister's diesel actually get?

#9302 of 9903 Re: - [habitat1] by Mr_Shiftright HOST

Aug 21, 2012 (6:10 am)

Replying to: habitat1 (Aug 20, 2012 3:28 pm)
Sure, SUV designers have learned a lot from their mistakes (and their lawsuits) about stability and handling. It's not really the SUV part that makes me decline a manual transmission in a particular car---I just don't like rowing big vehicles around with a gearshift lever. Besides, any kind of luxury vehicle with a manual transmission probably retards its resale value these days.

#9303 of 9903 Re: - [habitat1] by ateixeira

Aug 21, 2012 (8:40 am)

Replying to: habitat1 (Aug 20, 2012 3:28 pm)
early 1st generation with something like 13" wheels
 
14s actually, and very light at that. The BBS optional ones weighed something like 8.9 lbs per one web site.
 
Almost no unsprung weight for the suspension to fight with, just like the Elan that inspired it.
 
Tires were 185/60HR14, not exactly the stickiest stuff in the world.

#9304 of 9903 Re: - [ateixeira] by stickguy

Aug 21, 2012 (9:05 am)

Replying to: ateixeira (Aug 21, 2012 8:40 am)
my first new car was a 1985 (dang, i am old...) Dodge colt with the sport package (basically the turbo car, without the turbo) and it had that size tire. Absolutley the best handling car I had ever driven, since the tires were basically showroom stock racing tires (Yokohama A008s). Summer compound (did not work well in a NE winter..), and barely any tread. The outer 1/3 looked like a golf ball, with dimples.
 
but man, that thing stuck like glue. Which was good, because with 68 HP on tap, you did not want to lose any momentum.

#9305 of 9903 Re: - [stickguy] by ateixeira

Aug 21, 2012 (9:07 am)

Replying to: stickguy (Aug 21, 2012 9:05 am)
With autocross tires those were hard to beat. They'd crush a lot of vehicles with far more power. On a dyno a 90-93 Miata would pull about 99hp at the wheels.

#9306 of 9903 Where do you have this fun-to-drive? by victor23

Aug 21, 2012 (9:54 am)

To those who take their vehicle to a race track: I hear ya.
 
To all others: where do you guys have all this "fun" and "engagement"? I live in the land of speed limits (so much for your HP), 4-way-stops (so much for your handling/body roll), left-lane-campers and cruise controls. Everybody drives like in a funeral cortege; if you accelerate harder (even though still within the speed limit), it looks rude, or "maybe that guy has some personal problems". So much for your torque.
 
Now, think about it: huge trucks/SUVs are, in effect, deadly weapons and should be considered like that. They should have different rules of the road, lower speed limits, different lane discipline, and different driver's license requirements. Fair enough. Don't you think that driving SUV on a public road in a manner when you could say the difference between 0.6g and 0.91g should be treated like brandishing a machine gun or RPG? My apologies to those who would say that I am trolling.

#9307 of 9903 Re: - [ateixeira] by fintail

Aug 21, 2012 (10:52 am)

Replying to: ateixeira (Aug 21, 2012 8:40 am)
Heck, my fintail has 13" wheels. When new, the performance of that car was considered to be pretty amazing. It doesn't weigh much, so small wheels are tolerable.

#9308 of 9903 Re: Where do you have this fun-to-drive? [victor23] by fintail

Aug 21, 2012 (10:54 am)

Replying to: victor23 (Aug 21, 2012 9:54 am)
So where in the Puget Sound area do you live?
 
Speed limits and certain controls are only illegal to break if you get caught...and certain times of day can be used for more enjoyable driving. Early Sunday morning off the speed-trapped (it's all about safety, really!) interstates isn't so bad here.

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