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Future Vehicles Future Crown Vic and Grand Marquis
152 messages, Last post on Jun 07, 2008 at 4:54 PM
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Replying to: ionosphere1 (Dec 21, 2007 7:31 am) As to the LMDA, what that means is Lincoln-Mercury Dealer Advertising association. Every brand of car has some sort of local or regional advertising association, and a dealer would be stupid not to be part of it. Once a part, the assessment is non-negotiable. They don't just run ads, sometimes they augment the manufacturer's national marketing programs with additional or different incentives designed especially for the needs of their local markets. It's sorta like "Buy a Ford Mustang convertible from any of your participating Miami (or Southern Florida) area Ford dealers, don't buy a Nissan or Chevy" type of adds. The 'dealer specific' adds are additional to that, and paid for by the dealer himself to say 'Buy your Mustang from Joe Blow Ford, not from John Doe Ford across town' type of ads. The 2 weeks to arrival from invoice date sounds about right for most American cars. I hate to say it, but I hope you end up jealous about the 2009 or 2010 models. If they make the significant changes I'd like to see them make, I'm going to trade my low mileage, pristine 2005 Lincoln Town Car Signature L in on a new one. If they don't make any significant changes, I'm gonna keep mine. I still can't believe that Ford deleted the Moon Roof, THX Sound, and Navigation System from the options list. Now how stupid is that? 
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Replying to: euphonium (Dec 21, 2007 10:49 am) The XJ8L is an extremely nice car. I've driven a number of XJs. The newer ones are much more reliable than the mid-late 90's vintage and older, and the 80's & early 90's vintage XJs could be a nightmare to own. Still no matter how good the car is now, I'd have a little trepidation about owning one if there was no dealer within at least 50-75 miles of me. But the Jag is one very sexy set of wheels, no doubt. Good Luck to you if you do get one. By the way, what state are you from, anyway. You say you saw a photo of a "new" Town Car with suicide doors? That one must have slipped past me. Tell me where you saw it, I'd love to go look at it and do a little research on it. If you have a link to it, please attach it. A while ago I saw some photo's on what was purported to be the possible reincarnation of the Lincoln Continental, and that had suicide doors. But that was pre-Mulally at Ford, and since that time a lot of stuff was axed and Ford changed product direction. I'm aware of the probability of Ford bringing their re-engineered Australian RWD platform over to the U.S., and the possibility of it being the replacement for the Panther (CV/GM/TC) platform. Keep in mind that Ford had to mortgage virtually every asset they own, just to get the meager resources they do have. Don't expect them to get too bold in their product approach. At least not until some of their new products coming on line hit pay dirt for them. The new Fusion/Milan/MKZ, the 500-Taurus/Montego-Sable, the Mustang variants. and the Edge/MKX have all been working better than they expected. A lot of the face lifted vehicles like the '08 Focus, the Escape/Mariner, and the Expedition/Navigator are doing very well. The coming new stuff like the Flex/MK?, the MKS, the all new F150, and the coming Hybrid Fusion/Milan & possibly MKZ should add a lot to the bottom line. Together they'd fund a lot of aggressive product offerings. In the meantime, a significant facelift for the CV/GM/TC, about the magnitude of the new Focus/Mariner/Navigator, would recharge that market segment and buy Ford the time they need to develop world class replacements. Facelifts only cost a fraction of a complete re-do, and these cars are already very profitable for Ford, this could not only buy them the time they need, it would make them even more profitable and protect a market segment they already own.
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The strange thing is, is I am unsure exactly what the color will look like. It looks completely different on different websites. Even the Mercury website has it look different depending on the page, and even on the initial GM page if you rotate the car, it gets darker or lighter. The brochure looks different too, so I find it confusing. As dark blue is my first choice, I'm sure I'll like it, but I wish I knew what color to expect. Some webpages it looks sky blue, others purplish, and others grayish blue. There were no cars in that color on the lot. I'm in Seattle, so I don't know why the blue would be a hard sell.
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Replying to: peetiedog (Dec 21, 2007 6:28 pm) It is coincidental that Ionosphere1 & I live in WA, he in the Peoples Republic of Puget Sound while I reside on the Columbia down river from Portland, 50 miles. That I know the dealer there from his racing days fifty years ago causes me to hesitate about bringing a needy XJ8 to his shop for repairs & Tacoma is really to far to flatbed a car. If only the local Lincoln dealer had a qualified Jag mechanic. I understand your feelings about the BMW & Audi. My son in law has a recent 3 or 5 Sedan, our daughter just bought an X5 & our son's Audi A8 is very comfortable and quick. Out of habit, I prefer our TC for road trips. 66 Mustang GT Coupe, Ivy Green Metallic is my trophy car & garage queen having owned it for over 40 years. It hasn't been wet since '95.  "For the Love of Cars" 
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Replying to: ionosphere1 (Dec 21, 2007 8:19 pm) Your Lincoln-Mercury sales person must not be trying to hard to serve you, because putting your mind at ease about the color is easy. All Lincoln-Mercury dealers should have a photo album sized binder called a '2008 Mercury Product Portfolio' in their stores. Inside there is an 'Exterior Paint Colors' chart with small paint chips on it for every color offered on the 2008 Mercury product line-up, Those chips are 97-98% true to what the actual color will be, so should give you a reasonably acurate representation of what to expect. You should demand that he show you this information. Every store has had these product portfolios in store for about 3 months or more now. Ask him to print you out an order update, and while you're at it see if he'll provide you with a copy of the 'Dealer Order Retail Announcement' (DORA), tell him if neccessary he can hide or cover-up his cost numbers. This will allow you to see how the vehicle was ordered, so you can confirm colors and equipment, etcetera. You want to confirm your color soon, so as not to be stuck with the choice of taking a car you don't like, or loosing your $3000 non-refunable deposit. All production is down now, until just after New Years day; which means your car probably hasn't been built, and maybe not even locked in yet, so you may still be able to change it if necessary. Once the car is built, it should only take a couple weeks for transit time. Norsea Blue is not a hard color to sell in the Seattle Region. It's just that some dealers may not have had good success with certain colors, and so they don't stock them. Usually the hottest colors in cars like that are Black, Silver, and Champagne/Gold, with Dark Blue/Lite Blue/White all kinda vying for the 4th spot, with Red usually dragging the rear. If I were you I'd ask for a statement in writing about the deposit being non-refundable, signed by a manager. If you have not already signed one, DON'T. Clarify with them that you will loose your entire $3000 if you do not take the car, even if they later sell or dealer trade the car away? Obviously if they sell the car at a profit, their profit will immediately become $3000 greater because of them retaining your deposit. If they dealer trade the car away, other than transport costs, they're in a 'no harm - no foul' position. If they suggest that this is in fact the case, let them know that you are going to confirm the legality of this act with the Washington DMW, the Washington Attorney General's office, and the Better Business Bureau (BBB), then almost all the local TV & Radio new stations have some kind of 'Consumer Action Reporter' who'd probably love to sink their teeth into that one. Even if it is legal, $3000 seems like way too much of a penalty. Heck, from dealer's invoice to full MSRP, there's not $3000 of profit in the car. Try and negotiate some lesser, more reasonable amount, like $500 or maybe $1000 at the maximum. Sounds like this guy is gouging you. I'd bet that just having an attorney write a letter to the owner or general manager would solve that problem, and a simple legal letter probably wouldn't cost you more than a few hundred dollars. Whatever happens, good luck to you. The Grand Marquis is a great car, even if your salesman or dealership isn't so great.
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Replying to: euphonium (Dec 21, 2007 9:28 pm) NOW THAT'S WHAT I CALL A TROPHY CAR!  If you could only see me right now, I'm turning green with envy. I would look soooo cool in that car. 
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Replying to: peetiedog (Dec 21, 2007 11:09 pm) How did you get so knowledgable? Did you work in the industry? About the color, I didn't ask the saleman so I guess it's my fault. Before test driving it, I only looked on the Mercury website. It wasn't until later that I looked at lots of different sites and the brochure and noticed the color looked different. Any dark blue would be my first choice, so I'm not too concerned that I won't like it. Including this car, this will be my fourth vehicle in a row that I got in blue, so you can see that blue is my color. After giving deposit, I didn't get any "receipt" for it and saleman said they don't. Interestingly, they haven't cashed the check, because the $3,000 is still in my account and it's been about 6 weeks. Wonder why they didn't cash it? I'm not going to change my mind about the car and I'm going to give more than $3,000 for a down payment total. I wonder if they aren't cashing the check unless I tried to back out the deal? |
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I'm unclear about this. During the warranty period, does maintenance such as oil changes have to be done by the dealer to make sure they can't screw you in denying any warranty work? Like could I have my oil changes done by places like Jiffy Lube during the warranty period and not worry if my car gets problems during warranty? I'm assuming that the dealer charges a lot more for everything like oil changes.
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I cannot cite the suit or the source, but it is my impression that there was some kind of class action lawsuit in the last 10 years about that same subject...in other words, is the warranty void if routine maintenance is done by anyone other than the dealer, i.e. Jiffy Lube, Goodyear, Big 10 Tires, etc. I believe that the decision was for the little guy, that mean US, you and me...as long as the receipt shows that the oil was changed, the right oil was used, and the filter was changed, and it was within the mileage/time requirements of the manufacturer, then it must be accepted by the dealer if warranty work must be done... In other words, they can't refuse to perform warranty work if your oil was changed somewhere else, or your tires were rotated somewhere else, etc. But only the dealer can perform warranty work and be held responsible for it...if you take your car down to Brake-O to have new wheel bearings installed because Ford had a recall, the work done by Brake-O is not considered under warranty, and if anything goes wrong, Ford would not be responsible to repair (for free) any work done improperly by Brake-O... |
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Replying to: ionosphere1 (Dec 23, 2007 7:00 pm) You won't be disappointed in your Norsea Blue Grand Marquis. You should have gotten a receipt for your deposit, anytime you give anyone money, you're entitled to an acknowledgment that they have received it, and what it was for. There's an old saying, "What separates the men from the boys and the ladies from the little girls, is CASH"; they asked for a deposit to cement your commitment to the deal, so I'm surprised that they haven't cashed it. The great thing about cash is, you can always give it back, but you can't always get it. I wouldn't worry about it though, because should they cash it, your cancelled check can always act as your receipt, and you can always add whatever additional down payment you wish. Marsha7 is correct in that there were legal actions regarding manufacturers tying warranty coverages to a mandate for dealership maintenances. But that was much more than 10 years ago. And her answer is correct. The manufacturers can require a minimum standard of maintenance services be performed for your manufacturers warranties to remain in effect, but they cannot require that those services be performed at the dealership. You can in fact perform those services yourself, as long as you are able to provide receipts that these services were performed, or that you purchased the acceptable SAE (Society of Automotive Engineers) approved parts and fluids along with date logs showing when the appropriate services were performed. In the absence of such proof, approval of warranty repairs could be denied. Marsha7 is also correct in that manufacturers will only pay for their dealers to perform warranty repairs, with only very rare exceptions; and will only guarantee the quality of work performed by their dealers. All maintenance requirements, including types of oils, fluids and filters, can be found in the manufacturers maintenance manual that comes with your new car. Most manufacturers have come to realize that there's a lot of maintenance, wear, and repair work that their dealers are loosing, and have been doing a lot to help lower the cost of those basic services to the owners of their products. They realize that the dealerships have a much higher cost of doing business than the local Jiffy Lube, Super Tune and Big 10 Tire stores. They often sit on the most expensive real estate in town, and usually have factory trained (often unionized) technicians who are paid a lot more (often $25-$35 per hr. or more) + benefits, and they provide expensive specialized tools & computers that many places don't have. It's hard for dealers to offer specialists in all areas and still compete with the Jiffy Lube down the street, who may have recent high school auto shop grads working as lube techs making $8-$9 an hour. So they are encouraging and even subsidizing many of the basic services, to the point where the dealer's prices are very close to those offered by most of these after-market places. It's good for the dealer, the manufacturer, and the customer. The dealer wins because, the customer will often have other services & repairs done there, besides they get into the habit of coming to the dealer for all services and repairs. The manufacturer wins because, if the quality of repairs are better customer satisfaction with the brand rises, besides the more customers visit their dealer, the more they're exposed to the brand and the probability of repeat vehicle purchases increase. And finally the customer wins because, theoretically they're getting higher quality repairs that are hopefully fixed right the 1st time more often, besides other looming concerns that the customer may not know about can often be caught before the problem becomes a problem (like recalls, open technical service bulletins, and other growing service issues). Too often the Jiffy Lube guy doesn't care that your brake pads are only at 15% and may soon cause rotor damage, or the Big 10 Tire guy is not aware of an electrical component recall or a technical service bulletin out on your transmission. Needless to say, I'm a strong proponent of dealership servicing of your vehicle. The good thing with Ford is that they offer probably the industries best pre-paid maintenance plan available, ESP Premium Maintenance Plan. Plans are available out to 6 years or 100,000 miles. It still baffles me as to why most dealers never even offer it to their customers. They always offer the extended warranties, which can be a good thing as well (just make sure you get the manufacturer's branded warranty, a little more expensive but usually fewer holes in the coverage). But the pre-paid maintenance plans will cover money you're going to spend anyway, and usually your out of pocket expense may be as little as 50%-65% of what you'd spend on a pay as you go basis. The Ford ESP Premium Maintenance Plan besides covering all factory scheduled maintenance, will also cover most wear items (e.g.: Brake Pads & Linings, Wiper Blades, Shocks, Spark Plugs, Engine Belts & Hoses, etc.), additionally it will usually cover all taxes, hazardous waste disposal fees, it's good at any Ford or Lincoln/Mercury dealership and it's transferable. Virtually every finance source will gladly add it into the financing. Now that's the best way to keep your maintenance cost down. Typically you can negotiate pricing on your pre-paid maintenance plan just as you can on you car. Just remember, you are in the driver's seat. If you don't understand what's being told to you by your service advisor, have him or her re-explain it over and over until you do understand it. The only stupid question is the one that goes un-asked. I'd talk to the different service advisors and pick one who's personality is acceptable to you. Service advisors are like salesmen, except they don't sell cars or parts, they sell service and repairs. If you feel uncomfortable about what's being suggested to you, have them explain it to your satisfaction or get a 2nd opinion. Stick with your favorite advisor if you can, even if it means waiting a few extra minutes. They usually have a small commission or bonus component to their pay plan, and will often reward your loyalty by seeking out extra considerations for you when a gray area exists, expediting your repair order, or getting extra services for free (e.g.: loaner cars, discounts, etc.). Besides, they get to know you and your car's history. Often the manufacturer performs customer satisfaction surveys, and those surveys are critical to their ratings, bonuses, and raises. Let them know you will reward their active interest in you and your car with exemplary surveys and loyalty. If all else fails, there's always another Ford or Lincoln/Mercury dealer who would love your service dollars, even the factory pre-paid ones. Anyway, hope you had a merry Christmas and here's wishi |
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