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Hybrid Vehicles Hybrid Vehicles - Archived Discussions Honda Accord Hybrid - worth the extra $$$? 
223 messages, Last post on Feb 07, 2006 at 6:12 PM
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Replying to: pf_flyer (Mar 08, 2005 5:50 am) Why must that be the case? Is there some law that says the only purpose for hybrid technology is increased fuel efficiency/better mileage? How about more power from the same displacement ICE? Cleaner emissions? There may be a perception that improved fuel economy is the only purpose of a hybrid because that was the focus (small f) of the first commercial hybrids. But it doesn't mean it must always be so. The most recent hybrids, starting with the HAH and continuing with the Highlander and RX400h, will offer improved fuel economy but also more power. What is wrong with that? |
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"hybridization" does not and never has completely and only meant "huge miles per gallon" numbers. With Toyota planning on a Hybrid version of ALL their vehicles within 10 years (they have repeatedly said that) and Honda repeatedly saying "we can and will put our IMA system in ANY VEHICLE in our car line", that alone should signify that "hybridization" means more than just cars which get 45+ MPG. More torque, more power, improved MPG, cleaner emissions. That is what hybridization does. |
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I have driven the new Accord Hybrid (HAH), the V6 Accord and the Accord 4 cyl AND the new Prius. Around here, the Prius is hard to get and sells at a premium to MSRP, although that trend seems to be coming more in line around the country to selling AT MSRP. The HAH, around here, is available and sells fairly close to MSRP (no premium), while the other Accords (6 & 4) are available at discounts. The Honda Accords (all of them) are much better driving cars than the Prius, which is a neat car but a bit underpowered compared to the Hondas (in my opinion, as with everything else I say). That said, the HAH seems a bit of a contradiction to me, as I don't want or need that much hp in a "green car." The Prius gets much better gas mileage than the HAH. The HAH is a much "nicer" car in terms of driving and comfort. I was bothered by the HAH turning "off" the engine at stop lights and restarting when the accelerator was pressed when it was time to go. That may just be a personal quirk, as I have owned too many cars in my youth that used to "die" at lights and that was never a good thing:) Maybe the Prius does it too, but it wasn't noticeable. With the tach on the HAH dropping to zero, there was no doubt and there was a start up jerk. Frankly, if it is simply a dollars and cents analysis, the hybrid technology in the Hondas is a bit hard to justify. The initial cost premium, plus the "down the road" battery replacement seem to favor the conventional 4cyl models. Then you get into the emissions issues, and the hybrids are about as clean as are available, as I understand it. I have been driving an Acura TL for the last 5 years and it has been a great car. Frankly I don't want to "step down" to a Corolla-like driving experience, but I do want to "do the right thing". Nuts! What to do....
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Replying to: felton1 (Mar 08, 2005 12:05 pm) 
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Replying to: xcel (Mar 08, 2005 7:27 am) The Accord Hy. is interesting in that it has much better performance than I was expecting but the mpg's just aren't up to snuff. The price is, in this case, just doesn't justify the purchase unless Honda discounts the car significantly. Culliganman |
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Replying to: felton1 (Mar 08, 2005 12:05 pm) As far as emissions are concerned, the PZEV based non-hybrid Accord I4 is cleaner then the Prius II and much cleaner then AH. With that, the wife and I almost picked up an 05 TL for the 03 MDX tonight. Except the Acura dealership and I were about $1.5K apart … I have tried to get the wife to consider an Accord PZEV or the AH as the AH is now below invoice at a Honda dealership here in the Chicago area. She has driven both the I4 and the V6 Accord (not the AH) and wants something a bit nicer unfortunately. If only the TL was VCM’ed  Good Luck Wayne R. Gerdes
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Replying to: xcel (Mar 08, 2005 8:01 pm)
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Replying to: backy (Mar 08, 2005 9:53 pm) http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/findacar.htm - Nationwide - EPA Score/Fed rating Accord PZEV non-Hybrid: 9/Tier II-Bin2 Prius II: 8/Tier II-Bin3 AH: 6/Tier II-Bin5 Good Luck Wayne R. Gerdes
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Replying to: xcel (Mar 08, 2005 10:03 pm) 6/LEV II (automatic) 6/LEV II (manual) 6/Bin 5 (automatic) 6/Bin 5 (manual) 9/SULEV II (automatic) 9/Bin 2 (automatic) The Prius has 2 variants: 8/Bin 3 9/SULEV II The HAH also has two variants: 6/Bin 5 7/ULEV II It looks to me that depending on the Accord 4-cylinder variant you happen to buy, it might be cleaner than a HAH or Prius, but it's also the case that the Prius or even the 6-cylinder HAH could be as clean or cleaner than the 4-cylinder Accord.
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Replying to: backy (Mar 08, 2005 10:33 pm) There is only one variant of the PZEV Accord and Prius II. It depends on the fuel (LS or not) which gives the different EPA scores. The Fed emissions ratings are nationwide no matter the fuel’s sulfur content. The CAT of the PZEV Accord is more efficient then the CAT(s) in the Prius II. The AH isn’t even close. Good Luck Wayne R. Gerdes |
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