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#896 of 967 Scammed by Stonecrest Toyota
Sep 22, 2011 (8:17 am)
My car lease expired this month (Sep 2011). It was leased in New York state, but I am now living in GA. I called my dealer, and Toyota Financial....my only option to buy out my lease was to go to any Toyota dealership. I went to one and told them exactly what I wanted...to buy out my lease. They called for the payoff, marked it up $1000 and charged me $699 dealer prep. I kept saying that they couldn't mark up my residual. They kept saying they could. What they didn't say (and I unfortunately signed the finance papers) was that they paid off the lease, put the car in their inventory and sold it back to me. I feel stupid, but every question I asked was answered with a lie. If I was trading it in, I would have the option of accepting their offer. They pretended it was business as usual. I called them back the next day, accused them of fraud and told them I was reporting them to Toyota Corporate. They said they would give me my $1000 back. I assumed we would rework the papers. I had to go away for the weekend and now, the day of my appointment it's tonight), I find out my loan papers have been processed. I don't know what will happen tonight. Wasn't this fraud? They lied over and over. They never said they were buying my car from Toyota and selling it back to me! Why would I have done that? If I knew that and I wanted to be overcharged (I didn't), I would have used my 4% APR loan from Capital One (which could only be paid to a dealer) rather than B of A that they arranged 5.5% APR. They lied, they knew it was a lie, and I acted...loosing $1699. Fraud?
#897 of 967 Re: Scammed by Stonecrest Toyota [lucia38]
Sep 22, 2011 (9:17 am)
Let me ask this... upon selling it back to you, would it have been a CPO car?
#898 of 967 Re: Scammed by Stonecrest Toyota [lucia38]
Sep 22, 2011 (9:43 am)
Actually, Toyota Motor Credit will only sell the vehicle through a dealer. Basically they sell the car to the dealer and the dealer in-turn sells it to you. That's how it works and there is no other way a dealer could sell you a vehicle TMC owns. The dealer fee is not unreasonable but might be a little high. I paid around $400 for them to process the buyout on my Tundra. I called around and found one that was reasonable. Some
The $1,000 mark-up could be construed as fraud assuming you did not agree to that. But it sounds like you signed the docs and were aware of the markup at that time. I'm not sure how they could squeeze an extra $1,000 into the deal without you knowing/signing as such. There's no reason you couldn't have used your own financing as well.
If they'll give you $1,000 then it sounds like you did alright. Pay it down on your note and forget about it.
Sep 22, 2011 (2:43 pm)
..it might be that way, but I'm going to agree with the scammed part.
I know that on any of my leases, it says I can buy the car for a stated amount. There is no language that says the only way to do it is through a third party (the dealer), who can then add charges for their "services".
Now, I know there are makes/banks that won't let you do it any other way, but I'm betting if you had a contract lawyer that wanted to make a point, they could put a stop to this..
#900 of 967 Re: Well.. [kyfdx]
Sep 22, 2011 (4:04 pm)
I would agree, but there's usually some caveat built in that says they can work it how ever they chose. If there was someone that really wanted to take it on, I'm sure you could argue. But usually it's after you already signed the contract when you decide you don't like it.
#901 of 967 Re: Well.. [sebring95]
by kyfdx@Edmunds HOST
Sep 22, 2011 (4:39 pm)
I'm just bitching about it... I never buy out my leases... but, most of the banks I've dealt with will sell it to you directly, without any extra charges...
It just seems wrong to get extra charges that aren't part of the contract..
#902 of 967 Re: Well.. [kyfdx]
Sep 22, 2011 (5:01 pm)
It annoys the crap out of me as well, but the facts are it's really hard to fight them. I've done quite a few lease takeovers and then bought them out. GMAC and Toyota were the worst. GMAC actually had a different price for an early buyout depending on how you were terminating. A GM dealer had a typical buyout quoted (residual plus remaining payments less interest) vs some inflated number if you were trading it anywhere else. I can only imagine how bad the typical lessee gets rolled if they have no understanding of contracts, car sales, etc. I only did it to take advantage of someone else's loss and I made out quite well on the deals even with GMAC and Toyota's goofy buy-out rules. Almost no good leases out there to assume anymore. .
Banks are usually better to deal with than the captives. I've leased $10M in equipment in the last few months and the independent banks beat that tar out of (insert major equipment manufacturers captive finance here) in both terms and contract stipulations. Hard to turn away the captives on vehicles though due to the heavy subsidies they sometimes offer.
#903 of 967 Dealer sold leased vehicle before I was allowed to buy it at the end of lea
Sep 23, 2011 (9:12 am)
I turned in my F-150 after the inspection for damage at the end of the lease as the dealership said I could not talk to them about buying it or another lease or new car until I turned it in for another inspection from Ford at their dealership. I kept calling and going in to inquire about this second inspection. Finally, they talked to me, and discussed my options since I was over
mileage, saying a new car or lease would have to absorb 11K with their taking " a hit" of 6 thousand, along with my paying sticker price too. So I said I would simply pay 17K and buy my leased truck. Said he had to track it down, then 2 days later, said it was sold and I would have to go with paying 11 K cash up front and then finance the full sticker for a leased or new car. I think it is consumer fraud and don't know who to contact or if I have any recourse. I have very little money as it is let alone a ton of money to pay a lawyer and still have to possibly pay 11K etc. Advice? thanks!!!
#904 of 967 Re: Scammed by Stonecrest Toyota [sebring95]
Sep 23, 2011 (11:35 am)
Here's why I signed....I had arranged financing on line through Capital One, but found out it could not be used on a lease buy out. When I went on line to finance through Toyota, they sent me to the dealer. The dealer charge was high ($699 + tag/title) but all the Toyota dealerships in the Atlanta area charge the same. My NY dealership would have only charged for tag/title but I was in GA. If I had known in Aug, I would have driven up (I flew up over Labor Day to visit family!). I DID get my $1000 back from Stonecrest last night - they re wrote the contract and the B of A financing. I could have taken my chances in court because they lied about the mark up (that's fraud). And if I won, I would have gotten actual damages plus punitive damages. They did not say they were buying it, marking it up and selling it back to me. I was there to Buy Out not Turn In. They are the "middle man" and they do pay Toyota Finance directly. That's just the order of things, that is what the $699 covers. I was buying out my lease, per my contract. It was mine to buy at the residual price of $17,232. How Toyota sets up the paper trail should not violate my closed end lease. Here is what the problem was....they lied. And after 30 minutes of their lies they convinced me they could "mark up" my residual! Lying to get someone to sign something is fraud. They convinced me that as long as I was buying out through Stonecrest Toyota they could "change my residual"....their words! Even today, after getting my money last night, the salesman called me and to justify the fraud, he said it was not my car to buy!!!! They had the right to buy it and sell it back to me. No....my lease buy out option gave me the right. Just because the paperwork flows through them, Toyota has given them the opportunity to rip off the lessee. Was I stupid to sign? Seems so, except I'd say they wore me down and convinced me that's how it worked. The funny thing is....it took ONE call last week, saying "I know what you did, you lied about the legal ability to change the residual, sold the car back to me at a profit without touching it and disclosing what you did... lying to be unjustly enriched is fraud. If I wasn't going out of town the next day I would have had my money back sooner (Sep 17th instead of Sep 22nd). I think Toyota Corporate owes it to their customers to prevent dealerships from misrepresenting the process, ignoring the customers' legal rights under their leases, lying and gouging the lessee during the buy out process. $699 for an hours worth of paperwork is plenty. Marking up a buy out that was rightfully mine is unconscionable. A contract lawyer would have a field day. This has to be happening all the time with Corporate washing their hands and claiming they can't control them. Just like Post #? who lost his/her Ford truck through a dealer run around. One would think you know what to expect walking in the dealership to exercise your option rights stated in your lease!
#905 of 967 Re: Scammed by Stonecrest Toyota [sebring95]
Sep 23, 2011 (3:08 pm)
Honda finance sold me my S2000 directly. If I has used a Honda dealer they wanted to charge me the normal doc fee ($300 and up) and perhaps some other charges. I did have to go title it myself and pay the taxes, but well worth the savings.
Perhaps the original selling dealer (out of state) may have done it for less, but that is an 8 hour round trip.
I had heard that Honda discounted the price to the dealer by $500 to let them do it for "free" but every dealer I asked denied any such discount.
Some lease contracts have a fee they charge if you turn the car in, some charge you if you buy it as well.