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Lexus LS 460/LS 460L Styling Impressions

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#2285 of 3321 Re: LS 460 should be priced head-to-head with germans [ljflx] by cyclone4 Aug 11, 2006 (7:12 pm)
Replying to: ljflx (Aug 11, 2006 5:32 pm) Len,   It is so great to have you back posting again. You had every right to get upset at some of those "ignoramuses". I also saw what one of the participants called the Lexus fans. That behavior is so childish that he should have been banned from these forums.   Getting to the subject at hand, do you have any idea about what sort of AWD the LS600hL will have (electrical or mechanical)? Also, could you explain the peculiarities of both to those of us that do not know the fine details? I would think that the LS600hL will be equipped with the most sophisticated features no matter what. Replies to this message: ljflx (Aug 11, 2006 9:43 pm)
#2286 of 3321 Re: LS 460 should be priced head-to-head with germans [cyclone4] by ljflx Aug 11, 2006 (9:43 pm)
Replying to: cyclone4 (Aug 11, 2006 7:12 pm) I'm not an AWD expert. I always have thought and read that the Audi system is the best AWD system there is. My old boss had an A8 and he put snows on every year. Audi's tires were so low profile (and he had 18" tires, not 19") that the AWD wasn't much help to him in the snow. But with blizzaks it was like an LX470. So I wouldn't worry anout the system and if Lexus is going the Audi route it's probably better. But I'd think more about the tires you get with AWD as you may still need snows. In NJ where I am we seem to get snow in feet more often than in inches. So many storms in the past 10 years have been 1-3 feet. In that type of snow you aren't driving with a car as you want that ground clearance an SUV gives you. So I may take my chances with whatever tires I get given the snow is more infrequent (though much heavier when it occurs) than in places like Chicago or other midwest cities.   Other board - It has degenerated so badly with some of the most immature posts I've read on Edmunds in 6 years of posting. I noted that even Pat commented about it when I caught up on some posts. It's becoming a Euro board and without Lexus participants it'll die off. I'll stick to this neighborhood and avoid the lunacy that goes on over there. But I've also got a lot of business activity going on right now so I'll be away at times.   Let's get a good handle on the pricing but I'll tell you what I am hearing is there is a lot of demand for the LS600HL and in the most expensive trim no less.
#2287 of 3321 Re: LS 460 should be priced head-to-head with germans [stevekilburn] by atlas7 Aug 12, 2006 (5:05 am)
Replying to: stevekilburn (Aug 11, 2006 4:53 pm) To ignore price is absurd, they are not separate issues. Price is one of the reasons Lexus has been so successful. Lexus has always delivered more for less. They shouldn't stray from that strategy as they build the global brand. Most Lexus buyers could give a hoot about "prestige"; otherwise they would have bought German. The new lexus products speak for themselves, more luxo, power, and advanced technology. The Lexus pricing model will always be less than the Germans, for a better or comparable automobile. Lexus strategy will be to differentiate their cars via, reliability, luxury, power, etc...THAT is how they will get prestige, not by artificially raising prices to be in line with German pricing. Lexus prices will increase, but remain less than Germans pricing for comparable. Replies to this message: idele (Aug 12, 2006 8:48 am) stevekilburn (Aug 13, 2006 1:50 pm) idele (Aug 13, 2006 4:01 pm)
#2288 of 3321 Re: LS 460 should be priced head-to-head with germans [atlas7] by idele Aug 12, 2006 (8:48 am)
Replying to: atlas7 (Aug 12, 2006 5:05 am) I completely agree. I am a Toyota stockholder currently holding $200K+ worth of stock and have held at times $500K+ worth. So I write as an investor. I think that Lexus should continue pricing sensibly. Their vehicles are superior to the equivalent German brands in quality, reliability, service and retained value. With the hybrids they are vastly superior in technology. It seems that the LS600h will be priced at a bargain level:I don't think Lexus will make money on them for a few years. Production is evidently going to be limited. I believe Lexus should concentrate on bulding up sales in Japan itself and in Europe and the Middle East. If that leads to a severely limited supply in the USA, so be it. The LS460 itself with its newly refined powerplant and an eight speed transmission and all the electronics that works (and is superior to the Eurocars) and justly priced will be a very big winner Replies to this message: stevekilburn (Aug 13, 2006 1:50 pm) idele (Aug 13, 2006 4:01 pm)
#2290 of 3321 We have to look at the goal of the LS by drfill Aug 12, 2006 (7:13 pm)
When the LS is redesigned, it is to have 380+HP for a reason.      It will have an 8-speed for a reason.      It will grow in size for a reason.      It will be better looking for a reason.      I don't see a reason for giving the new car all of these attributes, and then not raising prices accordingly.      This car is not being redesigned, it is being revolutionized!      Toyota may be ignoring every other HELM (except Mercedes) on the market! They have made a killing with the LS, and they will price the Next LS so they will continue to. Toyota will win either way they go.      But selling 40-50k LS a year cheapens the car, to a point. Everyone knows it's an incredible car, but it's not precious and few.        I want Lexus to actually reduce volume sales by increasing prices, and not go to 350-400k sales a year. Pricing the LS too low is counterproductive.      You get numbers, but lose respect. Pandering to value market is......pandering!      How is Lexus growing and evolving? You can't just start making $150k cars. You have to grow and evolve into that.      The LS is their best bridge to get where they want to go. If the 600hL is $100k, where does the LS460 stop? It would have to get to at least $85k!      I want to see the LS460L priced at $70-85k, an the 600 from $90k-105k.      DrFill Replies to this message: ljflx (Aug 12, 2006 7:28 pm) 123itsdee (Aug 14, 2006 5:59 pm) nvbanker (Aug 14, 2006 6:07 pm) and 1 more...
#2291 of 3321 Re: We have to look at the goal of the LS [drfill] by ljflx Aug 12, 2006 (7:28 pm)
Replying to: drfill (Aug 12, 2006 7:13 pm) I'd say you are looking at 64-72K on the SWB, 74-82K on the LWB and 84-102K on the hybrid. You may still be able to get a 61-62K LS but it'll be a stripped car that likely will need a custom order. I don't see Lexus shipping over cars like that. In all cases a few specialized factory or dealer options may add 2-3K to each model variant. And I say they'll move 40-45K cars with the prices I noted and literally dominate the segment. The most LS cars sold since the late 90's were the 36K in 2002 and that came off a 22K figure the year before (when the 2001's started rolling in) and only 14K in the last 12 months of the model year 2000 car. Replies to this message: 123itsdee (Aug 14, 2006 5:59 pm) nvbanker (Aug 14, 2006 6:07 pm) nexuslexus (Aug 14, 2006 6:41 pm)
#2292 of 3321 Interesting by drfill Aug 13, 2006 (9:17 am)
So you believe the LWB will start at near $75k (with a minimum of options found on lots)?      I guess I believe the rumor that the LS will start a shade over $60, but the ones found on lots will start right around $65k, and the LWB will approach $75k with a Ultra Lux option Pkg.      I think a 25-30k sales volume should be the sales target, and if it exceeds that, prices are too low, and need adjustment.      DrFill Replies to this message: houdini1 (Aug 13, 2006 9:57 am)
#2293 of 3321 Re: Interesting [drfill] by houdini1 Aug 13, 2006 (9:57 am)
Replying to: drfill (Aug 13, 2006 9:17 am) Well, you have finally convinced me. Let's raise the price on the new LS to around $150K. That would make it a rare bird indeed. Then by this time next year we wouldn't have to worry about it as Lexus would be out of business!!
#2294 of 3321 Re: New information on LS600hL pricing [atlas7] by nvbanker Aug 13, 2006 (10:42 am)
Replying to: atlas7 (Aug 11, 2006 12:45 pm) Agressive pricing has been one of the reasons people tried the Lexus over the Benz and Bimmer. Then, they find out the price is lower, but the quality is better, and if they're not into "Ultimate Driving" so much, they stick around. I drove Lincolns happily for 16 years - but they don't make a large sedan that's acceptable anymore. A jump in price from a Lincoln to a Benz or Bimmer, attractive as they are, was tough to swallow. I had an S-500 on order, when I stumbled across Lexus, which I had not really considered before. They're not as pretty, but they are certainly as good, even better from a maintenance standpoint. Plus, after studying a bit, I found I really liked the mission of Lexus - they really do strive for perfection in the machine. For the $20 large, I found I could accept a little less beauty and driving fun (like Lincoln had much of that anyway?) for the awesome way these cars function, trouble free.   I hope Lexus doesn't lose the shine of their perfection model. They should never put a car on the road that hasn't been tested to exhaustion first. IF they do, they'll become just like everyone else, only less.

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