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2009 Toyota Corolla

3103 messages,  Last post on Dec 14, 2011 at 6:31 AM

You are in the Toyota Corolla Forum.

What is this discussion about? Toyota Corolla, Sedan

Messages Page 251 of 311

#2497 of 3103 Re: For example... [roxy11] by backy

Mar 11, 2008 (8:34 am)

Replying to: roxy11 (Mar 11, 2008 7:47 am)
you can bet that if a 6 year old hyundai platform kept pace in sales with a brand new honda or toyota platform, backy would have been screaming from the rooftops to let us know about it.
 
The only people I see screaming from the rooftops here are Toyota employees who rave about all the positive aspects of the Corolla and quickly shove aside any not-so-great aspects.
 
But since you mentioned it, the six-year-old 2006 Elantra did pretty well in sales, competing against the all-new 2006 Civic. And personally I would take my 2004 Elantra GT any day or night of the week (and twice on Sunday) compared to the 2009 Corolla. Not bad for a car designed in the 1990s.
 
Unfortunately for Toyota, the 2007-8 Elantra is a much better car than its previous generation. If the likes of Hyundai can make a car like that, I don't know why Toyota has so much trouble making a compact with a pleasant and roomy interior. It's not rocket science, and they obviously know how to do it (cf. Avalon).

#2498 of 3103 Re: For example... [backy] by kdhspyder

Mar 11, 2008 (8:40 am)

Replying to: backy (Mar 11, 2008 7:24 am)
All that you noted above is testament to great marketing. I've said here before that IMO Toyota's real strength is marketing. It's first and foremost a manufacturing company ( in general ) that nearly every other manufacturer would like to emulate. But IMO its real strength is marketing, which it does far better than any other vehicle maker. Essentially it sells the hell out of vanilla and it confounds the purists and annoys the engineering specialists ( Honda, BMW, VW ). These vehicles just shouldn't sell as well as they do.
 
As shown by Lexus, the RAV, the RX300, the Prius, HSD, GR engines, Tacoma, HiLux and Tundra when it chooses it can be cutting edge but usually it chooses not to be. Note though that a lot of those cutting edge successes are the result of ultra-sharp marketing and manufacturing.

#2499 of 3103 Re: For example... [backy] by kdhspyder

Mar 11, 2008 (8:51 am)

Replying to: backy (Mar 11, 2008 8:34 am)
Again it's a simple business decision. There is a price for each trim level. Exceed that price and you risk being ignored. This is not a luxo-segment where a few thousand +/- are inconsequential. This econo-segment values every $500 of pricing differential.
 
You are right that every vehicle could be as nice as an Avalon or Lexus but at what cost?
 
You rest all your arguments on 'See what Hyundai/Kia can do for much much less money.' You are right...for the moment.
 
But as you've seen I'm sure Hyundai is just about fed up with the US market and what they have to do to buy into it. The Sonata is no longer at any discount to the Camry, it's actually more expensive. Now there's a tough sale.
 
Then there's this..pretty amazing and funny too ( in a vicious way admittedly ).
From Business Week online...
My Way or the Highway at Hyundai
 
"It marked the fourth shakeup in three years for Kia's American operation. The U.S. unit of Hyundai, meanwhile, has churned through four top executives in five years. Many of the departures have come at awkward times. Hunt and Beavis got the news at the airport as they were about to fly from Irvine to an annual dealer meeting in San Francisco. According to several sources, Hunt's predecessor, Peter Butterfield, was dismissed during a dinner meeting with dealers at the Bellagio Hotel in Las Vegas—between the entrée and dessert. The companies declined to comment on any of these executive departures. "
 
[ Mr Butterfield, excellent choice for dinner. You're fired. Now what's for dessert. ]
 
The Elantra and the Sonata are very good cars, probably near or at the top of each segment but they don't sell anywhere near as well as they should even with massive discounts 'til now. Make each of them priced as they should from a content pov and they may tank even further. OTOH the stigma of being 'discounted' and 'second-rate' might disappear with more correctly priced trims and sales might grow. We shall see.
 
In general this segment is going to be redhot in the coming years and all producers should be able to sell out as fuel heads toward $10 a gallon. I'm in the middle of a two step project to compare the 2003 vs 2007 sales of all the major makers to see how the public has reacted to fuel increases.
Step 1 is done in that the 6 major BOF makers ( GM/F/C/T/N/I ) have collectively lost 1 million annual buyers.
Where did these 1 million buyers go? To more efficient vehicles certainly but which ones?
Step 2 which models have benefitted the most by this seachange in the US public's buying trend?

#2500 of 3103 Re: For example... [kdhspyder] by backy

Mar 11, 2008 (11:43 am)

Replying to: kdhspyder (Mar 11, 2008 8:51 am)
You are right that every vehicle could be as nice as an Avalon or Lexus but at what cost?
 
That's not what I said. I said that Toyota has the ability to make a car with a nice interior, for example the Avalon. I don't think that every car has to have an interior as nice as an Avalon or Lexus, and certainly not cars in this class. But how about wanting the interior of the 2009 Corolla to be as nice as others in this class, e.g. Civic, Elantra, Impreza, Jetta/Rabbit, Mazda3, Spectra. Is that asking too much? By your reckoning, I guess it is.
 
The Sonata is no longer at any discount to the Camry, it's actually more expensive.
 
That is absolutely false and you know it, or at least you should know it, since you are in the car sales business. Do you give these kinds of false statements to your customers, too? Maybe you should take a few minutes and do a little research, maybe right here at Edmunds.com, and compare the MSRPs of the 2009 Camry and Sonata. To be fair, you might want to add the options to the Camry that make it more comparable to the Sonata (e.g., VSC across the board, plus rear spoiler on SE, plus leather on the XLE). But try it both ways, with and without add-ons on the Camry, and let us know what you find out.

#2501 of 3103 It would be nice by pat

Mar 11, 2008 (11:51 am)

if we could talk about the new Corolla here and take these other conversations to more appropriate discussions...

#2502 of 3103 Re: For example... [backy] by kdhspyder

Mar 11, 2008 (12:08 pm)

Replying to: backy (Mar 11, 2008 11:43 am)
That's not what I said. I said that Toyota has the ability to make a car with a nice interior, for example the Avalon.
 
Yes of course they have the ability but at what cost? Again it's a matter of cost and price. They obviously chose one specific route.

#2503 of 3103 there is cost-cutting by nippononly

Mar 11, 2008 (1:14 pm)

that people will notice, and cost-cutting they won't. When Toyota is saving $50 per car by doing the kind people DO notice, the obvious question becomes, why don't they go that last $50?
 
There will be rebates on the '09 by summer, and they will total a whole lot more than that $50.
 
The domestics have been guilty of cheapo interiors for a long time, and have deserved the criticism they received for it. Toyota has not yet gotten down to the level of GM ten years ago, but GM is presently headed up, while Toyota still seems to be headed down. They seem to be passing each other as we speak.

#2504 of 3103 XRS VS S by cubssoxs

Mar 11, 2008 (9:15 pm)

Replying to: nippononly (Mar 11, 2008 1:14 pm)
Hey, is it worth it to spend the extra money and get the xrs model. I mean what is the difference between the two models. I know u get the 17 inch tires and the more powerful 2.4L engine. Has anyone test drove the xrs model? How does it feel compared to the S model?

#2505 of 3103 09 Corolla Review by moparbad

Mar 11, 2008 (9:45 pm)

09 Corolla Review Truth About Cars

#2506 of 3103 Re: XRS VS S [cubssoxs] by backy

Mar 12, 2008 (9:53 am)

Replying to: cubssoxs (Mar 11, 2008 9:15 pm)
Personally, I'd go for a Camry (with the same powertrain as the XRS) vs. an XRS, talking only of Toyotas here. The price would probably not be much different, and the Camry is a lot more car for the money--and the fuel economy is not much worse.

Messages Page 251 of 311

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