Last post on Nov 20, 2012 at 9:04 AM
You are in the Vans & Minivans
What is this discussion about?
Toyota Sienna, Honda Odyssey, Ford Freestar, Mercury Monterey, Tires, Wheels, Van
#731 of 1534 Re: PAX Concerns [gotribe]
Nov 07, 2006 (6:12 am)
I looked at the MDX and Lexus R as well and they are much more expensive and still lacked all of the options. This will be my last van as my youngest is 10, but in all reality this thing is CHEAP. I paid $31K(PLUS TTL) for the 1998 Toyota Sienna XLE that I got rid of to buy the Odyssey Touring and that van had no options to speak of! That was over 8 years ago! The PAX system is not gonig away and neither are expensive run-flat tires in general. To spend another $1500 in cash and time to change out the tires and then end up with a system that is compromised in some fashion is really weak. You'd be better off buying someone's PAX discard on EBAY and throwing the whole wheel/tire in the trunk on longer trips. Once again, this Touring has too many great things going for it to pass up the opportunity to own one and drive it.
#732 of 1534 Re: PAX Concerns [chirp]
Nov 07, 2006 (6:34 am)
"To spend another $1500 in cash and time to change out the tires and then end up with a system that is compromised in some fashion is really weak."
Hmmm, kind of funny as I see it just the opposite. We are a two van family with one of the vans nearing 130,000 miles and due for replacement in the foreseeable future (the replacement isn't a requirement, its just that the older one is getting a little long in the tooth). If it comes to pass that the Oddy gets nod this time around it would most likely be the Touring model. That said, I would absolutely dump the PAX system in favor of conventional wheels (with the TMPS sensors installed) and tires as I see the unconventional PAX system as being "really weak."
FWIW, the newer of our two vans has conventional tires and a TPMS system and as Mrs. Shipo has a tendency of finding nails (once this year), screws (three times this year) and curbs (once this year damaging the sidewall of both right side tires) with fair regularity, the TPMS on her van has proven itself to be quite valuable.
Due to the above incidents I've needed to buy three new tires with a total cost of just over $400. Were it that she was driving a van with the PAX system those same three tires would come to $1,800 (if you believe our local Honda dealers' claim of $600 per wheel/tire assembly). Even if I could find a place to do the deed for $200 per wheel, that's still $600 or half again as much as what I've spent on three new Goodyear Assurance TripleTred tire replacements.
Yup, Iím very convinced that the PAX system is extremely weak.
BTW, your statement about a new wheel and tire set costing $1,500 is a bit high. I can get a set of AT Italia S5 wheels shod with Michelin Energy LX4 tires shipped to my house for $1,114.86 (including mounting, balancing, taxes and shipping charges) from TireRack.com.
#733 of 1534 Re: PAX Concerns [shipo]
Nov 07, 2006 (8:56 am)
For 2 years Mrs. Shipo can drive into your Honda dealer and get a whole new Pax assembly. There is no limit to the number of nails and screws she can find in 2 years. When your Pax warning goes off in the Touring model it will count down how many miles you can continue to drive on it. If you have aftermarket tires you must tell all drivers of your van to disregard that warning and stop immediately. I said "$1500 in cash and time" and I guess your time is worth nothing. Sounds like you've already spent a fair amount of time researching alternatives.
Obviously, you may put more miles on your cars than I do and may take longer trips than I do and I can understand where the need for a run-flat may not be your cup of tea. In my situation the PAX system works just fine and if my wife has a flat she knows to check the tire and then drive to the dealer for replacement.
I'm happy that you understand the value of the Touring model as it really is a bargain and it drives like a dream...PAX and all. I wouldn't hesitate to buy the Touring model all over again.
#734 of 1534 Re: PAX Concerns [chirp]
Nov 07, 2006 (11:01 am)
Just be sure to inform your wife that she should ONLY have flat tires when she is within 150 miles of a Honda dealership and that the dealership is open when she has the flat (and she can get there before it closes). ALSO, please tell her to only have one flat at a time since the dealer only usually stocks one PAX wheel at a time. ALso, bring all information regarding the PAX wheel to the dealer since most havent a clue about pricing/procedures etc. Finally, make absolutely sure she never takes long trips on a Sunday since most dealership service centers are closed and she may end up sitting in hotel room for the night with kids going nuts (as happened to me).
#735 of 1534 Re: PAX Concerns [red_sox999]
Nov 07, 2006 (11:23 am)
This has turned into a testy little debate! I think the bottom line is that when the PAX system is working well and replacements are readily available at a fair price, life is good. But that does not seem to be the case yet. The irony is that the owner of a "Touring" vehicle with "run flat" tires can find himself/herself in a situation that proves to be expensive/inconvenient. Honda/Michelin need to execute better on this one even if it means providing an 800 number to owners in an emergency that either gets a tire to them quickly, or gets them to a location that has one. Great concept, weak execution.
#736 of 1534 Re: PAX Concerns [gotribe]
Nov 07, 2006 (11:45 am)
1-877-PAX-TIRE. If you read your service manual Michelin asks you to call this number first and they will direct you next as to what to do. Does it work? Obviously, not for some. I don't need my wife sitting by the side of the road trying to fix a flat. She has yet to find a nail, screw or run into a curb.
My only point here, quite frankly, is to praise the Touring model for what it is and believe that people should take a good look at this model regardless of how they feel about the PAX system. This is one beautiful ride for the dough.
That is all! enjoy the ride
#737 of 1534 Does PAX work with sidewall failure?
Nov 09, 2006 (12:40 pm)
Chirp writes about hitting a curb. It usually meses up the sidewall. Would PAX save you if sidewall is gone? Regular RFT would fail as it is the said sidewall that supports the weight.
#738 of 1534 Re: Does PAX work with sidewall failure? [krzyss]
Nov 09, 2006 (12:59 pm)
I think the reference to the curb vs. sidewall issue started with my comment about my wife taking out two brand new Goodyear Assurance TripleTreds earlier this year on one of our vans. In her case she executed an accident avoidence manuver and caught the curb at some speed resulting in rim cuts to the sidewall of both right side tires. This in turn caused significant visual damage to both tires, and a slow leak in the front tire.
Were it that she had RFTs of any type (PAX or otherwise) on her van there is little doubt that we would have had to replace both tires anyway as the cuts in the sidewall were down to the belting material. Would she have been able to continue to drive after the incident? Yes. That said, she made it to her office which was another 20 miles beyond where she caught the curb just as the TPMS system was registering a low tire.
#739 of 1534 Re: Does PAX work with sidewall failure? [krzyss]
Nov 09, 2006 (1:38 pm)
Regular run-flat: Since no support ring exists, I'd have to say "it depends" on how big the slice is. I don't think they'd do as well with a "2-inch hole" in them, as used in the above PAX demo. It is hard to generalize here.
#740 of 1534 Re: Does PAX work with sidewall failure? [actualsize]
Nov 09, 2006 (1:50 pm)
Thank you for posting that link, actualsize. I had not seen that before and it is informative. I'm not sure I would encourage anyone to drive very far with part of their sidewall missing, but it's good to know that it may be possible with the PAX system. Usually a big sidewall hit comes in twos(hitting a curb while skidding on snow,etc.). I would definately not drive very far on two blown sidewalls, PAX or no PAX.