Last post on Nov 20, 2012 at 9:04 AM
You are in the Vans & Minivans
What is this discussion about?
Toyota Sienna, Honda Odyssey, Ford Freestar, Mercury Monterey, Tires, Wheels, Van
#63 of 1534 Re: I am now driving my NEW 2005 Sienna XLE Limited [cccompson]
Dec 18, 2004 (7:31 am)
For understanding my points and passion. I agree with your explaination of the drawerbacks of PAX. As much as I like the PAX technology and the Ody, I feel it is too limiting and controlled too closely by Honda/Michelin. And leaves the consumer stuck in many ways.
My passion is very much based on the dealer and Honda NOT explaining the issues and limitations to consumers. NOT even the Road and Track story explained them adequately. There are others on these forums that found out ONLY after the purchase. This almost happened to me.
gkkim, The Sienna Run flats you are referring to ONLY come standard on the AWD that has NO room for a spare. The Touring has room, but Honda wasted it. The Toyota RFT can be swapped at any time with a standard tire, even in an emergency when stuck somewhere without a RFT. Toyota dealer and literature explained their RFT adequately. Honda hid the facts! I bought the 2005 Toyota Sienna XLE Limited FWD without RFT, I had choice.
isellhondas, I was simply stating what I experienced with the back seats in the Ody at my dealer. Glad you have had great luck. No abuse was put on the Ody I test drove and the lever, JUST broke very easily. Maybe you might want to investagate that the lever in question is made of a thin plastic, making this no so hard to see how it broke. The Sienna simply had a better folding system, void of plastic handles.
As far as the people how thinking I never get flats. Well great for you. But all it will take is one on a weekend or in a remote place. Not to even speak of tire replacements when Honda / Michelin, who some say want to differentiate, will do so by allowing you to pay whatever they want.
PAX allows no snow tires or donut spares so why has Honda made these tires a requirement of the Touring instead of an option? The Touring model in Canada has normal tires. Guess why? They could have differentiate, by offering PAX as an option. And when sales are figured out. I bet they will.
steve, my 2005 Toyota Sienna XLE Limited has tire pressure sensors and has regular normal tires, not RFT. This is easily accomplished to comply with new laws without RFT. PAX has been around since 1998, and after seven years they are still not wide spread. Maybe, I will wait until Goodyear, Pirelli, Toyo and Sumitomo are all selling PAX that fit the Ody Touring and there are actual tire places that repair them before I will buy PAX. Knowing that it is coming does NOT help me when I am stuck somewhere. I do agree RFT technology will be widespread on day, BUT it is to be seen if the PAX technology licensed from just one company is the answer to this.
My posts were not meant to bash Honda or PAX as I almost bought the Honda Touring. It was meant to clear up some peoples misconceptions and help them make an informed choice. I almost made a choice I would have regreted after spending 40K. Seems Honda is NOT telling the entire deal here. Most buyers are either unware or mis-informed. How can you make a clear choice without the facts?
Dec 18, 2004 (9:18 am)
And, again, I hope someone from Honda corporate monitors these boards so they can see just how strongly some people are against these.
As far as getting stranded in a remote location, I guess the same could apply to people who buy unusual cars that don't have dealers in very many places. I can think of quite a few and I really see little difference between getting stuck somewhere with a PAX flat or a blown water pump on a Saab.
Dec 18, 2004 (10:01 am)
The Ody has "4" tires which will increase the odds of a flat, the Saab only has "1" water pump!
Looks like Honda should have just included a can of "flat" fix and stayed with old technology.
#66 of 1534 Re: Saab? [just4fun2]
Dec 18, 2004 (10:52 am)
That Saab has dozens of critical parts that could fail besides a water pump! I only used that as an example.
#67 of 1534 One more point
Dec 18, 2004 (11:57 am)
Honda said that they will get you a replacement PAX tire if you have a problem, just give them a call. What if you are in an area where you have no service for your cell phone? If you are more than 125 miles away from a dealer you could just as easy be in a "no" cell area. Honda can't get you your replacement tire if you can't call them!!!
Yes, I know that if any car has problems and you can't use your cell phone you are in big trouble, but why add to the problem of driving with these tires?
Maybe, Honda's little robot that jogs can bring you your replacement PAX tire!!! I wondered why Honda was working so hard on this little guy!
Dec 18, 2004 (12:49 pm)
Some people look for positives and others the negatives. The PAX system like many things has both.
#69 of 1534 Oh, come on now.
Dec 18, 2004 (1:04 pm)
Some people live in the real world and some people don't. The fact remains that this PAX system could be a huge problem for many Ody owners and they may not even be aware of their situation until it is too late for them.
Like I mentioned before, a can of "flat" fix for $3.99 and regular tires would be a better system than what Honda decided to do with these PAX tires.
The positives will be noticed as you drive your Honda, you will enjoy them. The negatives like PAX tires will bite you in the A$$ and you will be out 40 GRAND!!!
Honda slipped up of this tire combination, admit it.
#70 of 1534 You seem to be forgetting...
Dec 18, 2004 (1:58 pm)
They can be RUN FLAT for 125 miles.
If your Saab decides to lose a fuel pump in the middle of nowhere, it can't be driven at all!
Yeah, I see negatives and I'll point them out to my customers and let them weigh the pros vs. the cons fot themselves.
Not everyone sees the glass as half empty the way you do.
And, only time will tell if Honda has, in fact, "slipped up". If this proves to be the case, I will, indeed, admit it.
#71 of 1534 Isell's right, there are tons of things
Dec 18, 2004 (2:16 pm)
that could go wrong and leave you stranded. Heck, buying a Saab is almost asking for it. But I think if I had bought a Honda - where reliability is a big selling point - and ended up getting stranded due to TIRES, of all things, I'd be pretty upset. PAX should have been OPTIONAL, if offered at all.
Dec 18, 2004 (2:22 pm)
The glass is not half empty, it is broken and in Honda's case it's customers might get a flat tire from the fallout. Most of the posts here did not forget that you can run these tire 125 miles. Obviously you can't understand that people here feel that 125 miles might not be enough and they just don't feel confortable with this set up.
Sorry, I don't think that people here are going to fall for what you are saying when it comes to what negatives you tell your customers. Can anybody here remember a car salesman pointing out the negatives of their product? They will trash the other makes for sure.
The middle of nowhere? If that happens to be at a top of a mountain, then the Saab with the broken water pump can at least be rolled down hill, how about the Ody with a bad set of tires?
Don't get so up tight. I would be very happy if someone points out the negatives, who wants to find out after you spend 40 GRAND!!!!
Your logic is funny!!! Not worth 40 GRAND, but funny.