Last post on Oct 24, 2013 at 5:25 PM
You are in the Porsche 911
What is this discussion about?
Porsche 911, Porsche Carrera GT, Coupe, Convertible
#1988 of 2175 Re: 993 c4 versus 996 with psm? [loastcoast]
Nov 17, 2008 (9:35 pm)
Don't know about the C4, but that PSM on the C2 is something special. Just got back from the Porsche high performance driving school in Alabama. We tried the skid pad with and without PSM and there was a big difference. On the track (2.4 miles with 14 turns and a 350 ft elevation difference) no oversteer at 50+ in the turns.We had some tight turns, but perhaps not as tight as you are talking about. These were 2008 911's and 911 S's. The 911's we used on the track had the PSM button fixed so you couldn't turn if off. By the way, I won the raffle, and got to take a hot lap in a GT3 with the race car driver Cass Whithead at the wheel. The G forces were unbelievable. The thing that impressed me most about the 911 was the breaking. We would be at 110 to 120 (there are so many turns, the straightaways are too short to go any faster) up to the last second, then hard hard breaking just before the turn. Amazing how fast these cars can stop in such a short distance. My first time on the track.
#1990 of 2175 Re: 993 c4 versus 996 with psm? [Mr_Shiftright]
Nov 18, 2008 (5:26 pm)
Interesting web site. I will be checking it out. I looked at the video before reading the caption and thought he must have lifted off on the accelerator - too wide of turn for oversteer to happen at that speed. I had something just like that when it started to rain cats and dogs on the track in Alabama. The lead instructor (four to a group single file-you only get to pass in the master course) would not slow down on the straightaways. I hit a puddle going 115 mph and the rear end went all over the place. Locked in on the steering wheel and got lucky - the car stayed straight - very scary. They told us to break hard before the turn, slowly release the brakes during the first half of the turn then slowly all the way down on the accelerator coming out of the turn, petal to the metal until the next turn. They had cones to show us when to break, the apex, etc. The instructor in the lead was also on a walkie talkie. It was fun. I was sure the rear end would come out, but it didn't. Lifting off the accelerator or hitting the brakes in a turn throws the weight of the car to the front, when you want the weight on the rear tires coming out of the turn. They hammered that into us during the course. It's great having the engine ( weight) in the rear as long as you don't make a mistake. Hear's something you may not have heard. In rain, narrow tires are safer than wide tires. Weight per sq. in. of tire on the road is greater with narrower tires. In the rain, the 911 S's, with the wider tires, had to slow down more than the base 911's to stay on the track. I should have gotten into racing 40 years ago. On the other hand, maybe not. I like being old.
#1991 of 2175 Re: 993 c4 versus 996 with psm? [buylow]
by MrShift@Edmunds HOST
Nov 18, 2008 (5:36 pm)
That's right.....slow in, fast out...
Lifting off abruptly in a hot turn is a good way to spin any car around.
I know guys 70 years old who are vintage racing. Go for it.
#1993 of 2175 Porsche Service, there is no comparison.
Nov 22, 2008 (5:19 pm)
It has a been a while since I last posted. In any case, for all you current and future Porsche owners. I have five vehicles, three of which are Porsche's. A 996 2002 C4 Conv, 2006 Cayenne Turbo and a 2007 997S Conv. My 996 has had past issues with oil leaks, not much in volume but a concern nevertheless especially because of RMS issues.
About a year and a half ago I noticed, for the first time, a few drops of oil on the floor of my garage and brought the car to the dealer. They replaced the RMS at my cost, about $1800.00. Six months later, again the same oil leak, again the dealer replaced the RMS this time at their cost. Four months ago, again I noticed drops of oil and promptly brought the car back. This is where the story gets very interesting.
The dealership calls me and tells me that it's not a RMS problem but a problem in the casting of the metal and thus the engine is unable to be sealed 100%. The solution, a brand new engine courtesy of Porsche. Keep in mind, the car is out of warranty and has 45k miles. You can imagine my delightful surprise. The only thing I have to pay is 25% of the dealer cost of the engine. Yesterday I receive another call and the dealer tells me he has great news and possibly not so great news. Let's start with the great news, they uncrated the engine and lo and behold they discovered a 3.8 high output engine. Clearly, not the original 996 but an engine for the 997S! The mechanic is convinced its an x51. I am not so sure but in any case the worst case scenario I have a 355 hp engine vs the original 320 hp. The bad news, he recommended I replace the original clutch with a stronger unit to withstand the increased power. Let me tell you, this is not bad news for me since I can appreciate the cost of an additional $900.00 for the parts, labor N/C since the unit is already disassembled and thus re-assembly of the clutch is part of the engine work.
I must admit, when I finally digested the news I began to have doubts about my good fortune and thus decided to drive, unannounced, the 320 miles round trip to verify with my own eyes. Sure enough, I get to the dealership and there are the two engines, practically, side by side. My fears and doubts are quickly put to rest.
Funny, these past couple of months I have entertained the thought of adding an F430 to my family, but I can without a doubt state that this thought has been completely eliminated from my mind and thus a 911 Turbo is the works.
What can I say, Porsche,in my opinion, is in a class of its own.
Thank You Porsche!
I will keep this forum posted.
#1994 of 2175 Re: Porsche Service, there is no comparison. [911nut]
Nov 24, 2008 (6:26 am)
Very cool! Thanks for sharing that story. Do you mind telling us which dealership this was?
#1995 of 2175 Re: Porsche Service, there is no comparison. [madmanmoo]
Nov 24, 2008 (7:46 am)
A dealership in Corpus Christi, Tx, a very small dealer; in fact, it's one of those setups in which VW/Porsche are together.
#1996 of 2175 Re: Porsche Service, there is no comparison. [911nut]
Nov 24, 2008 (1:41 pm)
Sounds good. Glad they are taking care of you like they should!