Toyota Yaris

Replying to: kneisl1 (Apr 26, 2006 5:02 am)

I don't know about actualy statistics, but based on personal experience at several driving schools, wet skidpad, high speed slalom and braking exercises, etc, I can tell you that in a real severe pinch, it is invaluable.
 
The argument that claims ABS is useless or of marginal value is about like the arguments where someone knows the 1 person who was hurt by actually wearing a seatbelt, or the 1%-er who would have been better off without an airbag, IMHO.
 
ABS is misunderstood. It is not intended to make you stop shorter. It is to allow you to have more steering in the event of a skid. See, when you skid, and the wheels stop turning, you can no longer steer since your steering wheels have to turn to be effective. No human can pump the brakes on and off 15 times per second while steering and driving effectively. Of course, no system will completely reverse the laws of physics, either. There must be a reason why aircraft and heavy trucks have used ABS for many years now, and were the first to utilize the system. I doubt is was because it was a useless idea.
 
I beg to differ with those who claim ABS, stability contol, etc, are not invaluable. Sure, there is a tiny instance where maybe not, and .5 percent of drivers might be that skilled that they can do as well on their own. For you non-believers, I invite you to go to a track with a wet skidpad and try some accident avoidance in a car with and without ABS, and car with and without stability control.
 
One course I attended at the Panoz facility in Braselton, GA, I had a really talented instructor, and he told me that no matter how good he was, the truth was he could not beat ABS or ESP ( stab control ) when it came down to it. Then he proceeded to take me out on a couple of demos of the systems, avoiding hay bales, etc, and proved it to me.
 
To each his own. Some people think the moon landing was faked in 1969, too, and they are entitled to their opinions. I'll stick with ABS. I do agree that some may overdrive the ABS system feeling a false sense of security. Since that is not how I drive, not a concern to me.
 
I went to look at the Yaris today on the way home. Unfortunately, I got a clueless salesperson who did not know that the sedan even had AMS available. First he told me it was not an option, until I pointed it out on the window sticker. Then, he tried to talk me into a Corolla instead. Too bad that with 30 min of internet research, I knew far more about the car than he. The fact that he took a cell phone call in the middle of talking to me, and told the person on the other end that he would be done with me in 10 minutes kind of made me think, hmm, so I only have 15 total minutes with you? After hanging up, he proceeded to tell me that for my information all Yaris were sold at MSRP. I had not even asked about price. So, I couldn't see even considering spending money at a place where their people are this incompetent, so I left disappointed.
 
Anyway, glad to hear that ABS is an option on the hatch. Now, when I get ready, all I have to do is find a Toyota dealer with any semblance of knowledge and tact. I used to sell Audis for a few years, and I guess maybe I am used to high end stores like Audi and BMW, where it was my experience that people are treated a little differently and salespeople are a heck of a lot more professional. I don't know. Quite shocked at the ignorance and lack of sales skills at the Toyo place...sad.

Replies to this message:
• bruyere (Apr 26, 2006 10:42 pm)
  • vermonter16 (Apr 27, 2006 2:10 am)
• brighterdeath (Apr 29, 2006 1:20 am)

Replying to: steve333 (Apr 26, 2006 1:46 pm)

Replying to: steve333 (Apr 26, 2006 1:46 pm)

Now there is an intelligent well thought out post!
         Mackabee
           

Replies to this message:
• backy (Apr 26, 2006 7:22 pm)

Replying to: kneisl1 (Apr 26, 2006 6:24 pm)

Replies to this message:
• backy (Apr 26, 2006 8:38 pm)

Replying to: kneisl1 (Apr 26, 2006 7:47 pm)

are definitely looking down their noses at the liftbacks, which mostly carry lower sticker prices, which (I would guess) are less profitable for them.
 
BUT the real problem is that very few Yarii, even the sedans, are being sold. The dealers are just AWASH in Corollas, now with national cash back, and still basing at around $14,7 for CEs with no options. So the Yarii just sit and sit.
My local dealer has the same two he had three weeks ago, or whenever that was that they started coming in to dealers. Both are automatic sedans, one S and one base model.
 
I pull 40 mpg in everyday driving in my Echo (stick shift), have been tracking the mileage very closely for the last few months to come up with that average. I got 46 mpg without trying in the one highway trip I did in it a couple months back. One of the things I have wondered is whether the Yaris would do as well. I kinda think not, but maybe.
 
I don't know about anyone else here, but I much prefer the interior of the liftback to that of the sedan. For one thing, I prefer the center stack where the three HVAC controls are stacked vertically, rather than the triangular configuration in the sedan. I also prefer the cloth inserts which cover the doors all the way up to the window sills, where the sedan gets hard plastic there.
 
If you are a fan of the passive safety features, I think you would be crazy not to take a very close look at the xA, especially if you like the Yaris hatch. For $14K flat, you can get a manual with the side airbags/curtains (and of course, all the other stuff like power package, etc), and it comes standard with ABS. Not to mention a pretty good stereo with face-level tweeters, something you CAN'T get from the factory in a Yaris.
 
Me, I would like a Yaris hatch with the convenience package (and maybe the extra airbags and ABS as stand-alones? I am not sure). I figure I could get that exact car (in a stick) for $1200-1500 less than the xA. The power package, I could not care less about. I much prefer the styling of the Yaris to the xA, outside and in.
 
dhill4: can you tell me, how did you place the order - over the internet, or in person? Was the dealership resistant to taking a special order, and did you have to put down a deposit? If so, was it refundable?
 
Thing is, I wouldn't mind placing an order and waiting six months, as long as I knew that I could get the exact car I wanted, and that they wouldn't just waste my time and come back with "sorry, the car you ordered was unavailable" six months down the line. That would be irritating.

Replies to this message:
• nvarch1 (Apr 27, 2006 11:24 am)
  • nippononly (Apr 27, 2006 1:26 pm)
    • mackabee (Apr 27, 2006 6:08 pm) and 4 more...

Replying to: bricknord (Apr 26, 2006 5:16 pm)

Replies to this message:
• vermonter16 (Apr 27, 2006 2:10 am)

Replying to: bruyere (Apr 26, 2006 10:42 pm)

Maybe there should be a seperate forum for the argument for and against ABS.... Be that as it may I am going to say one more thing and then be done with it... I hope
 
My husband has been on various deployments. Before a deployment he has to take a defensive driving course. He's done this many times now. You go and crash cars and learn how to run other's off the road....you skid around and do 180s and such and he said that he would not drive a car without ABS if he doesn't have too. He said with as much knowledge as he has at driving and with as much practice he's had he cannot control a vehicle as well in certain instances and that is when ABS comes in handy. For him he said it just makes it easier... I haven't take this course but I do no other folks who have and they all agree. So I encourage those who do not believe...go to the tracks. The course my husband took cost a couple of thousand...and he had a week long day in/day out driving tactics in all kinds of conditions... He's taken it at least three times.
 
It is nieve to think that just because you drive defensively you avoid getting into those situations... I would like to think that I drive defensively....but when I'm going 65 - 70mph in the left lane and some idiot pulls right in front of me from the shoulder and a dead stop and I've got people next to me so there is nothing I can do but slam on the brakes.... It wasn't my driving that caused the close-call...it was someone elses. With the amount of driving I do a year, day in and day out especially in an area where aggressive driving is the norm...I would prefer to have ABS.