- #2639 of 4597
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Re: If you paid $19.5 for civic EX you should know [dwatwd]
by backy
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Oct 23, 2005 (6:17 pm)
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Replying to: dwatwd (Oct 23, 2005 5:28 pm)
You make a good case for making sure to take the entire family with you when you test-drive a car, to make sure everyone fits. It's also a good example of how you can't tell everything by the numbers. By just the numbers, it seems the '06 Civic's interior should be cramped. But I've found it has as much or more usable space for passengers than cars with larger interior dimensions and interior volumes. Nice job of packaging.
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- #2640 of 4597
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Kia's strategy..blah
by fuzzer34
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Oct 24, 2005 (6:20 am)
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When I had my '04 SI in for service, the dealer pawned me off on a Kia Rio...
Well....what a car. Load buzzy motor, no acceleration, and very noisy interior. I didn't feel quite safe in this "entry-level" car. It felt like a Geo from early 90s. After getting my Honda back, I knew why I spent extra to get the refined Honda. I gave the dealer some lip service after that fiasco. Next visit, they gave me a loaner '05 accord. That's how you treat customers.
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- #2641 of 4597
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Re: Throttle-By-Wire [bigal3]
by fordfocus
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Oct 24, 2005 (6:31 am)
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Replying to: bigal3 (Oct 23, 2005 3:29 pm)
On my test drive, there was much to take in, but a few things that I noticed were that the throttle was mapped for abrupt tip-in, like a 1999 Jeep Grand Cherokee or Jetta, maybe to give the illusion of greater power (or to compensate for the lag- but this would only serve to highlight it?); the shifter was very light effort but did not have any self-centering force so that the 2-3 shift would hit the 'thingy' between 1st and 3rd; the clutch was grabby near the top end of release so that the window of time for a smooth clutch-gas interaction was very small...but like others have said, anyone could prolly get used to it, just like how one gets used to driving mtx's from one car to another...but it certainly is different than any other mtx I have driven so far. Others on vtec forums have noted the throttle lag, not as bad as an Acura TSX or Mazda 3 (both DBW), but still there...
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- #2642 of 4597
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Re: Kia's strategy..blah [fuzzer34]
by backy
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Oct 24, 2005 (6:34 am)
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Replying to: fuzzer34 (Oct 24, 2005 6:20 am)
Was that a '06 Rio? It's been totally redesigned from that primitive car of '05 and before. Quite a nice little car now, especially considering it costs a few thousand less than a Civic.
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- #2643 of 4597
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Re: Kia's strategy..blah [fuzzer34]
by fordfocus
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Oct 24, 2005 (6:36 am)
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Replying to: fuzzer34 (Oct 24, 2005 6:20 am)
hehe, it's their way of showing you Honda refinement 
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- #2644 of 4597
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Re: Dyno Testing HP on Coupe [micweb]
by fordfocus
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Oct 24, 2005 (6:51 am)
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Replying to: micweb (Oct 20, 2005 1:17 pm)
2.0 liter Duratec 20 is the same as Mazda3 2.0 and designed by Mazda, no?
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- #2645 of 4597
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Re: Dyno Testing HP on Coupe [fordfocus]
by micweb
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Oct 24, 2005 (8:37 am)
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Replying to: fordfocus (Oct 24, 2005 6:51 am)
The two engines are the "same" in the same way the "platforms" are the same - which is to say, so many details are different that they are almost different engines. Certainaly the output is in favor of the Mazda. But we are offtopic in this Civic forum. 'nuff said.
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- #2646 of 4597
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Re: If you paid $19.5 for civic EX you should know [user1235]
by 6spdtl
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Oct 24, 2005 (10:58 am)
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Replying to: user1235 (Oct 23, 2005 3:22 pm)
These cars look as alike as a Toyota highlander and a Pilot look alike. The honda is completely different, the hood on the honda is dramatically shorter, it has far greater greater windshield rake. The healights are completely different, the rear end is completely different. The character line on the civic is low on the doors, the mazda has none, Mazda has copied acura's pentagram grille. Obviously beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but these cars are as different as cars get. No one has done a full test of the new civic thus any 0-60 times you are quoting are pure speculation. The inside packaging of the honda is much better. The engine on the Mazda is nowhere close to the Hondas in refinement, the 2 liter version of Hondas four produces 40 (25%) greater horsepower than the Mazda's. The only reason the Mazda outscored the previous Civic in CR testing is that it handled better (of course it was competing with a 5 year old design) and it was ranked only marginally better. The new civic make the old civic seem dowdy in comparison, the Mazda 3 series, although a very nice car, is barely a contender to the new Civic. In the handling department (the only area zoom zoom was better than the civic) the new civic and the Mazda 3 are a wash, in every other area the Mazda is simply not up to par. The mazda may offer more optional goodies, but the truth is that if you dress up a turd in diamonds its still a turd;)
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- #2647 of 4597
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The best marketing strategy....
by bottgers
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Oct 24, 2005 (11:18 am)
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.....for Honda and Toyota might be to tell perspective buyers to go drive the Korean cars first, then come and drive their cars. People would then see first hand why Hondas and Toyotas are more expensive. You get what you pay for. There is no such thing as a free luch when it comes to buying vehicles.
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- #2648 of 4597
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Re: The best marketing strategy.... [bottgers]
by backy
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Oct 24, 2005 (11:37 am)
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Replying to: bottgers (Oct 24, 2005 11:18 am)
That might work well for Honda with the Civic in certain situations, for example the all-new Civic vs. the five-year-old Elantra, but it could backfire as a general strategy in other cases, e.g. Sonata vs. much pricier Accord and Camry, and the Corolla with its driving-position issue vs. the Elantra and Spectra. It could also backfire when people see they can get a really nice economy car, e.g. Rio and (soon) Accent, with comparable room and safety equipment to the Civic LX, for several thousand dollars less.
It's interesting that whenever I've mentioned to a Honda or Toyota dealer that I would be comparing their cars to Hyundais, they've never said, "Oh, that's a really good idea! Go over there and drive those cars, and you'll see how great the Honda/Toyota is in comparison--well worth the extra money!" Instead, I got either bad-mouthing of the Koreans ("Don't you know they are really poor quality and unreliable??") or just a simple "Oh."
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