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Hybrid Vehicles Hybrid Vehicles - Archived Discussions How do Hybrids work? Newbie questions encouraged! 
139 messages, Last post on Aug 02, 2007 at 5:38 PM
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Replying to: xcel (Dec 30, 2004 2:28 pm) Unless this has anything to do with reliability issues of the overall system (not so smooth deceleration), I don't see a point in ABS overriding regenerative braking.
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Replying to: robertsmx (Jan 03, 2005 9:05 am) Unless this has anything to do with reliability issues of the overall system (not so smooth deceleration), I don't see a point in ABS overriding regenerative braking. ___I guess you had better take that up w/ the 1000’s of engineers that work on the hybrid programs at Ford, Honda, and Toyota then. ___Good Luck ___Wayne R. Gerdes
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Replying to: xcel (Jan 03, 2005 9:25 am) In fact, I firmly believe that it would be possible to integrate ABS and regenerative braking by completely eliminating the involved hydraulics. It is not the electrical systems that are slow, quite the opposite from what you suggested earlier. “Speed”, which should translate to smoothness and effectiveness, would be an advantage with electrical/integrated system. The way I see it, potential of slow reaction/action time from hydraulics may be to blame if there is an exclusion involved in all regenerative systems from ABS. If true at the moment, this may be a non-issue in the future where electric motors may control ABS. And not just ABS, but AWD system itself could see mechanical systems giving way to electro-mechanical systems (for the very same reasons). In case of AWD, we already see a few systems around.
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Replying to: robertsmx (Jan 03, 2005 10:09 am) ___It is possible and I have already stated that many of today’s safety functions will be integrated into the Hybrid drivetrain but they are not today in the case of the Honda’s and probably not the Toyota. ___Good Luck ___Wayne R. Gerdes
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Replying to: xcel (Jan 03, 2005 10:18 am) The question however is, besides (relatively) slow response of hydraulic systems (which translates to non-linear deceleration), I don't see a reason why ABS/regenerative systems couldn't exist. But then, I don't know everything. Perhaps someone here does.
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Replying to: robertsmx (Jan 03, 2005 10:39 am) The question however is, besides (relatively) slow response of hydraulic systems (which translates to non-linear deceleration), I don't see a reason why ABS/regenerative systems couldn't exist. ___Have you ever driven a hybrid? If you have, you must have missed the non-linearity of regen braking. If you haven’t, they why bother making suppositions? ___Good Luck ___Wayne R. Gerdes
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Replying to: xcel (Jan 03, 2005 10:58 am) We're talking about tiny fractions of a second. You're not going "to feel it" simply by driving a vehicle. System is much faster than we humans can perceive/experience things.
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Replying to: robertsmx (Jan 03, 2005 1:32 pm) We're talking about tiny fractions of a second. You're not going "to feel it" simply by driving a vehicle. System is much faster than we humans can perceive/experience things. ___The answer then is that you obviously haven’t driven a hybrid and you haven’t read reviews on hybrids closely enough in the past. The non-linearity of Regen is one of the most striking items about hybrids and yes, you can and do in fact feel it. The AH not withstanding because I haven’t read of a non-std. braking feel or driven it personally. ___Good Luck ___Wayne R. Gerdes
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Replying to: xcel (Jan 03, 2005 2:46 pm)
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Replying to: robertsmx (Jan 04, 2005 6:26 am) I will repeat myself … ___Why? You haven’t driven a hybrid so you have never felt a hybrid’s braking non-linearity’s. Until the AH and I have not driven it yet, hybrid’s do not have a smooth interaction between light and strong regen and release let alone the transition between regen and the mechanicals. You are not switching electrons through a PC board, you are attempting to switch a rather large electro-mechanical MG/Set on and off at tens of times a second if need be and all the Hybrids I have driven are not capable of this feat to date. Conclusion, no MG/Set emergency braking capabilities on any hybrid today that I know of although I have not read much on the details of the Escape HEV to say with 100% certainty that all hybrids emergency braking/control are handed off to an electro-mechanical safety system that all automobile manufacturers use in non-hybrid’s today. ___Good Luck ___Wayne R. Gerdes
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