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Hybrid Vehicles The Great Hybrid Battery Debate
669 messages, Last post on Apr 06, 2009 at 2:32 PM
You are in the Hybrid Vehicles Forum. Your Host is pf_flyer
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2004 Prius has 1.5 KWH(kilowatts/hour) battery and Civic Hybrid has about 1 KWH battery. How big is HV battery capacity compare to pure electric vehicle(EV) battery? Toyota Rav4 EV had 28 KWH EV NiMH battery to achieve 87 miles range when travelling at 60mph. That's more than eighteen times larger than Prius battery. In order for Rav4 EV to have the same range of hybrids(700miles), Rav4 EV will need to have 225 KWH battery! To be fair, acknowledge that Rav4 is a heavier SUV and Prius is a mid-size sedan. Dennis
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Replying to: usbseawolf2000 (Jun 10, 2004 6:08 pm) The main reason that the voltage is inverted and increaste to 500 volts is because smaller wires can be used becuase the current is less. Powrer= current times volt times the angle between voltage and current (o for resistive, +/_ for inductive or capcitive) assume resistive. For example if the mote is a 2.5 Kilowatthour motor thatt menas the instantaeous power is 2500 watts or 2500 amp hours. If that is deliver by 12 volts then a current of 208.3 amperes while the same motor running 500 volts would only require a current of 5 amperes. The smaller the amperes or current the smaller the wire is need and the less loss due to impedence. P.S. - Were you awre the Prius can only go in reverse via the eletric motors. The ICE can not supply reverse power. Does that mean the Prius is a mild or soft hybrid in reverse?
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Replying to: midnightcowboy (Jun 11, 2004 6:45 am) Yes, I am aware. Prius ICE can not supply power to the wheel directly but it can power indirectly by generating electricity which then powers the main 50kw motor. Therefore, in reverse, Prius acts as a serial hybrid. Remember, the electricity generated from MG1 does not have to go through the battery, HSD can route power directly to the 50kw MG2. Dennis |
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The Rochester Hills-based firm said it and Cobasys LLC, its manufacturing joint venture, had entered into a settlement agreement with Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., Panasonic EV Energy Co. and Toyota Motor Corp. The settlement was reached through arbitration. As part of the agreement, Cobasys and Panasonic will cross-license each other on current and future patents to avoid litigation. http://www.freep.com/news/statewire/sw100650_20040707.htm Let the number increase and the price fall !!!! Dennis
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Replying to: usbseawolf2000 (Jul 07, 2004 7:02 pm) I seriously doubt the price of NiMH batteries will get significantly cheaper. Batteries of all kinds have gone up in price no matter what the rest of the Electronics market is doing. The only competition is generic batteries that have proven themselves inferior to name brand. At least in all the ones I have bought. If you are counting on the price going down by the time you need to replace the batteries, I would be real surprised if they are. Hopefully the generous warranty will take care of all your battery replacements.
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Replying to: gagrice (Jul 07, 2004 7:45 pm) Consumer electronic AA Nimh rechargable battery prices has been going down since it was introduced. Not only the price, the capacity had gone up as well. When they came out they had 1500 mah rating(higher is better). Now, they have 2400 mah batteries for less than what 1500 mah used to cost! Dennis
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Yesterday during the chat, someone mentioned that NiMH batteries do not have memory effect. That issue needs to be cleared up in detail. Short answer: NiMH do have memory effect but at a very slow rate. Long answer: Compared to AA NiCD batteries, AA NiMH batteries suffers much less of the memory effect. AA NiMH retains/remembers 80% of it's capacity after 500 cycles. Hybrid Electric Vehicle NiMH batteries' memory is 20 times better. They have 10,000 cycles until it is reduced to 80% of the original capacity. That is to show the rate of the memory effect. The battery is still completely functional after that point. Replacing the pack is up to the owner if he/she wants to regain efficiency of a new hybrid car. Dennis |
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Replying to: usbseawolf2000 (Jul 07, 2004 7:55 pm)
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The life of HEV battery should not be measured with the miles it is driven but under what condition. For example, during highway cruising, the battery is rarely used. Another extreme case is, short and hilly blocks in San Francisco with stop signs at every corner. The battery would use up plenty of recharge cycles in this situation, only if you accelerate hard enough so that the battery supply power to the main electric motor. Dennis |
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Replying to: gagrice (Jul 07, 2004 8:14 pm) Very true. More importantly, not all chargers are created equal either! It is the cheap charger that damages the battery by charging too fast and over heating the battery. Overcharging the battery when it is full also damages the battery. The charger in the Prius is very intelligent and powered by 32-bit CPU. There are temperature sensors to protect the battery pack with active cooling system. It is also packed with the latest charging technology to prolong the battery life. Dennis |
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