Last post on Nov 18, 2012 at 11:21 AM
You are in the Land Rover
What is this discussion about?
Land Rover LR3, SUV
#2618 of 4548 To all that it concerns -
Sep 14, 2005 (10:47 pm)
Misinformation definately can be a harmful and damaging. However if I felt like I could rely 100% on what the dealer and manufactuer are telling me, it would be a perfect world, but when the "information" I hear first hand from the dealer and first hand from the manufacturer, overtly contradictory, its extremely frustrating and almost impossible to avoid the "urge" to seek input from "like" minded consumers experiencing the same thing. The sales rep at my dealer, didn't even know about a recall - or so he says. He knew NOTHING about a 90 degree temperature "element". Thats well and fine I suppose, but Land Rover DID tell me that "temperature" is an issue. My dealer rep to this very moment says he knew NOTHING about the recall. On the oher hand, however, Land Rover told me not to worry about it, as gasoline doesn't ignite easily......geshhhhh.....am I supposed to just sit by and allow my wife and children to become an exception?...a statistic? It takes time to unstrap a two year old out of car seat you know....God forbid someone trying to do it with the vehicle on fire. Is this the extreme? Yes probably so. Is this something I want to worry about while I am at work, day in and day out until the manufacturer can revise and fabricate a safe fuel tank for my LR3? Nope !Will I deal with it? I suppose I will for the moment. Today I turned in the Chrysler pimp mobile the dealership gave me yesterday and picked up the LR3...I will wait my turn for a "donor" fuel tank. Am I overjoyed about it....again....a big NOPE ! I just took the drive out tags off it Monday. How do I feel about it? Well...I don't think they "my dealer and LR" would knowing allow me their customer to be exposed to a life threatening issue. Like I said....I think its TOTAL bitch, but what is my recourse? I paid cash for the car - certainly have no leverage there.The descrepiancies between my dealer and LR alarm me. I have turned in a formal complaint to LR. So what else can I do. I can trade, but hate to take the financial beating. My choice at this time, is to designate my 04 Range Rover as the official "grocery getter", drive the LR3 myself and wait for the new and improved LR3 fuel tank. I would like to think the dealer didn't know about ANY of this August 11, 2005 when they sold me the vehicle - perhaps they didn't. Hey...on a good note.....the door panels aren't smudged with that white funk anymore! Better yet my fellow LR owners, the dealer didn't charge me for the over night stay. Happy motoring gentlemen ! What else is there say?
Sep 14, 2005 (11:09 pm)
Not only did "they' tell me to be mindful of the outside temperature, "they" also told me NOT to fill the tank up beyond half of a tank. Well.... we live in the "Gulf" states and believe me, when we find a gas station that EVEN has fuel, we fill 'er up to the top, as we HAVE to be mindful of the fuel crisis we are encountering down here because of Katrina. I suppose I will just have to chalk it all up to bad Karma
#2620 of 4548 Re: PS: Karma [david10635]
Sep 15, 2005 (9:22 am)
Did you buy 2005 or 2006 LR3? I'm in a process to buy new 2006 LR3? Any suggestion will be helpful. What are the dates when the fuel tank problem occured? Ant tip will be appreciated.
#2622 of 4548 recent posts regarding LR3 problems
Sep 16, 2005 (1:33 am)
The recall is for a know and experienced problem with the fumes of a refilling gas tank igniting and causing the car to catch on fire. They noticed the problem when someone, WHILE refueling their car, WITH THE ENGINE RUNNING, and temperatures well above 90*F, the fumes ignited and the cars were destroyed
I think that says it all folks
to the LR3 owner who is on his 4th Rover, i believe the owner's manual explicitly states using higher octane fuel. Regarding your post, it appears that if your wife had been running regular octane fuel, then that would contribute to the problems of idle, starting, economy, performance. (Please research octane and how it relates to your engine's efficiency and performance) True some SAE's have stated with knock sensors, a motor can compensate but this is not always the case. The ECU is specifically mapped to using this octane level to achieve the ratings of HP and torque for this vehicle.
This may sound like a rant..and it is. How many are actually reading their owner's manuals? Recently the posts have taken on the "if i paid x amount of $$$ then my expectations are ad nauseum ad infinitum" Every new vehicle will have 1st year teething problems. If it's still under warranty which i would presume that they are since the LR3 is only about 1 year old, then get it fixed. If it's a purge valve, fuel tank problem, there is obviously a fix available. If you go in with the aforementioned attitude then of course the sales/service will probably dismiss you. They are human after all.
I'm fortunate to own and drive the vehicles i have and each one requires a different learning curve. I've also learned to turn a wrench and get my hands dirty in the pursuit of knowing as much as i can about my cars. If your gripe/rationale relates to money spent then perhaps you should consider a bicycle or drive something a bit more pedestrian. The LR3 is rather advanced and there's no doubt in my mind that any vehicle that utilizes so many electronic assists, will give a problem here or there esp. in first year..and maybe it's second and third
#2623 of 4548 Re: recent posts regarding LR3 problems [kandg]
Sep 16, 2005 (8:10 am)
"The recall is for a know and experienced problem with the fumes of a refilling gas tank igniting and causing the car to catch on fire. They noticed the problem when someone, WHILE refueling their car, WITH THE ENGINE RUNNING, and temperatures well above 90*F, the fumes ignited and the cars were destroyed"
"I think that says it all folks "
This is not true as stated in previous threads and on The NHTSA.
Please see the actual recall information and stop spreading errornous information.
Make : LAND ROVER Model : LR3 Year : 2005
Manufacturer : LAND ROVER
NHTSA CAMPAIGN ID Number : 05V376000 Mfg's Report Date : AUG 26, 2005
Component: FUEL SYSTEM, GASOLINE:STORAGE
Potential Number Of Units Affected : 17263
SOME SPORT UTILITY VEHICLES MAY HAVE FUEL TANKS THAT CONTAIN AN INTERNAL BREATHER PIPE THAT WAS NOT MADE TO SPECIFICATION. THIS COULD RESULT IN EXCESSIVE SWELLING AND CRACKING OF A GROMMET AND SUBSEQUENT DETACHMENT OF THE BREATHER PIPE FROM A CONNECTOR TUBE. WHEN THE FUEL LEVEL IN THE TANK IS ABOVE THE LEVEL OF THE DETACHED JOINT, FUEL MAY THEN ENTER THE BREATHER PIPE.
THE VEHICLE MAY EXHIBIT MIL ILLUMINATION, FUEL ODOR, DRIVABILITY CONCERNS SUCH AS HESITATION, MISFIRE, STALLING, ROUGH RUNNING, OR DIFFICULTY IN STARTING. IF THE AMOUNT OF FUEL FLOWING INTO THE BREATHER PIPE REACHES THE VAPOR CANISTER AND EXCEEDS ITS CAPACITY, THE EXCESS FUEL MAY BE DISCHARGED ONTO THE GROUND. FUEL LEAKAGE IN THE PRESENCE OF AN IGNITION SOURCE COULD RESULT IN A FIRE.
DEALERS WILL REPLACE THE FUEL TANKS. THE RECALL IS EXPECTED TO BEGIN ON OCTOBER 14, 2005. OWNERS SHOULD CONTACT LAND ROVER AT 1-800-637-6837.
LAND ROVER RECALL NO. B016. CUSTOMERS CAN ALSO CONTACT THE NATIONAL HIGHWAY TRAFFIC SAFETY ADMINISTRATION'S VEHICLE SAFETY HOTLINE AT 1-888-327-4236 (TTY 1-800-424-9153), OR GO TO HTTP://WWW.SAFERCAR.GOV.
This says it could start a fire. Does anyone see where is say 90 degrees ? Does anyone see where it says during refilling?
Then again if it is on the internet in any form it must be true.....
#2624 of 4548 Re: recent posts regarding LR3 problems [grendalfly]
Sep 16, 2005 (8:38 am)
It seems to many, it is dumb to be filling ones tank in high temperatures with the engine running, but there's more to this. Most of these problems started in Dubai and UAE, where temps above 90 are the norm. In addition, it would be rare for a native of either country(read rich) to fill one's own tank. That would be left to others, while the driver remained in the vehicle. Since air conditioning is a must, the engine would have to be running.
Please don't assume that what appears abnormal to some, is necessarily wrong, or even crazy. Just when you think that says it all...
#2625 of 4548 Re: recent posts regarding LR3 problems [paxton]
Sep 16, 2005 (10:09 am)
Please don't assume that what appears abnormal to some, is necessarily wrong, or even crazy.
I don't perceive it as matters of protocol, procedure or custom. This just appears to be lack of good common sense. No matter what part of the world you're in.
If i remember my basic physics properly...(it's been a while )
Vapour and Flash fires from fumes require spark. Explosions (in this case gasoline fumes) are caused by the buildup of pressure due to expansion and the resultant rapid release conversion into kinetic energy by combustion initiated by ignition.
#2626 of 4548 Re: New Owner - Rear Climate, Etc. [jbmjr]
Sep 16, 2005 (10:17 am)
Final update - 8 days in dealer service. Swapped out front passenger seat for new front passenger seat either because they could not figure out problem or part was back ordered (I can't figure out from the service receipt). Supposedly fixed climate control - rear control is now working and heat does seem to be coming out, but the temp setting is clearly off (setting it at 70 or 68 degrees is just not as chilled as it was, but maybe it was just so off in the first place...).
At any rate, that is it. I am off now, not to post until I see what appears to be the inevitable fuel tank/leak issues arising!
#2627 of 4548 Re: recent posts regarding LR3 problems [kandg]
Sep 17, 2005 (2:05 pm)
Just a lurker here. However, I had to comment on this poster's allegations regarding fuel octane.
I think you need to research octane yourself first before hurling stones at someone else's lack of knowledge. The octane of a fuel relates to its tendency to pre-ignite, and is used in higher performance engines that create combinations of heat and pressure in the cylinder that may lead to pre-ignition. It has absolutely nothing to do with starting,idling, or economy. If this new LR motor is like many newer ones, its knock sensor will retard the timing, throttle, or other engine parameters when it detects engine knock to prevent damage to the engine. This is going to be on the top end of performance, though, or when the engine is hot and under a heavy load. For the vast majority of people, they will never notice the few HP lost to lower octane. Despite all of the bull crap you read on these boards about how people gained 5 mpg by switching to premium, the real scientists have proven that higher octane stops pre-ignition, and that's all.
The other issue I feel compelled to comment on, somewhat unrelated to this post, is the amount of effort by some LR owners, and other owners of vehicles with not-so-good reliability records, to dismiss those with problems as "trolls," uninformed, FUD spreaders, or other name calling. Individual owners do generally own one vehicle of a kind, which is not a statistical sample. Land Rover, as a brand, has been toward the bottom of statistical reliability. Justify your individual luck however you want, but statistically, one buying a Land Rover is rolling the dice, relatively speaking.
That's fine with me, though. We all can buy whatever we want (or can afford) in America. If the positive aspects of the vehicle are more meaningful than the issues, then you will enjoy the car just like a Corvette owner. I, for one, bought a Land Cruiser because I could not stand the issues faced by many on this board. It also has issues, but reliability is typically not one of them.
I suspect that I will be labeled as spreading FUD, but this is my $0.02. With some facts about octane.