Last post on Oct 27, 2006 at 3:23 AM
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Toyota Prius, Hybrid Cars, Hatchback
#688 of 711 Re: Prius in the snow [Mr_Shiftright]
Sep 14, 2006 (9:48 am)
"I called a friend at San Francisco Toyota (they sell more Priuses than any other dealer in the country!) and he said he hadn't heard any complaints about this....but then, it doesn't snow very much in San Francisco. He also said he didn't think the 2007 Prius would allow disabling of the traction control, and the only change he was aware of is that the VSC system now goes on base model cars."
Hopefully some people will post their experiences this winter. Any Prius owners out there want to deliberately drive into snow to see if the 2006 Prius will "rock"?
#689 of 711 Re: Prius in the snow [Mr_Shiftright]
Sep 15, 2006 (8:03 am)
It's not likely any but the most inside engineering people at the manufacturer know what was done (if something was done) to mitigate a problem like this. I highly doubt it would perculate up to the dealers, specially one in such a temperate zone as San Fran.
Now then, if some smart tech living in the snow belt was running to ground a root-cause for claims of an owner, and if that tech made the report through channels, well then, maybe that tech would know what was happening, and what was being done.
The point is, with highly computerized complicated control systems going in our vehicles, how does the user community (or service technicians, or salespeople) end up "knowing" what the system is really doing, and if it is working per design... if it's a bug, or a "feature".
Systems behaving as normal or being problematic? That's our future.
#690 of 711 energy screen
Sep 16, 2006 (7:15 pm)
The illustration of the battery charge reprented by blue lines. The blue lines never get up to the top. Does this in dicate a faulty battery? 2006 model
#691 of 711 Re: energy screen [seroq]
Sep 16, 2006 (8:52 pm)
I have read here that the battery is kept at 70+% to allow head-room for charging on the go, and all of that. There has to be some place for the energy to go to, when being generated. If the battery was at 100%, that could cause problems.
That was the non-techie answer, but I am sure someone will be along and provide the specifics.
#692 of 711 Re: energy screen [terry92270]
Sep 17, 2006 (7:35 am)
The "detailed answer" is in order to ensure the battery lasts a long time Toyota runs it from about 30% to about 80% charge.
If you allow the battery to discharge too far you run the risk of fully depleting at least one cell. This will result in reverse charging of that cell as the battery continues to discharge. This will destroy that cell eventually.
If you fully charge the battery, some cells will fully charge before the rest. They will then be "overcharged" and will heat up a lot, causing them to release pressure and loose some electrolyte. They will then loose capacity and be more susceptable to this and to the discharge problem above. Further, NIMH especially and NICD batteries too will generate a lot of heat after they reach 80% charge. This is why a "rapid charger" switches to trickle charge at about that point. Toyota wanted to avoid that extra heat and so doesn't -normally- go above 80% charge. The heat can cause the cells to overpressure and vent as above.
Sooo, the battery is operated between 30% and 70% charge, except in special cases -
a) If you run out of gas you can actually discharge the traction battery down to about 20% charge. This will allow only 2-3 starts of the ICE (gas engine) so be careful if you get into this state. Note that if you run out of gas you have to put in at least three gallons before the engine will catch. The ICE is what charges the traction battery (unless you're regen. braking).
b) If you decend a long hill (say a mountain pass), the traction battery can end up with about 80% charge, and perhaps a little more - indicated by full charge on the MFD. This charging by regen braking - and it's this function that caused Toyota to leave some "room at the top" for charge to be added.
#693 of 711 Re: energy screen [pathstar1]
Sep 18, 2006 (12:38 pm)
Great explanation. Thanks.
#694 of 711 Re: energy screen [seroq]
Sep 18, 2006 (2:18 pm)
According to this answer [emphasis is mine]:
"If you decend a long hill (say a mountain pass), the traction battery can end up with about 80% charge, and perhaps a little more - indicated by full charge on the MFD."
Yes, there is something wrong if your display never indicates full. The "full" indicator is what Toyota considers approximately 80% charged.
#695 of 711 Re: energy screen [stevedebi]
by MrShift@Edmunds HOST
Sep 19, 2006 (7:06 am)
I wonder if those folks "converting" Priuses to run on "plug in" electric power are asking for trouble down the road. Sounds like it.
#696 of 711 Re: energy screen [Mr_Shiftright]
Sep 19, 2006 (12:04 pm)
"I wonder if those folks "converting" Priuses to run on "plug in" electric power are asking for trouble down the road. Sounds like it."
It is certainly a question, however, the battery still would be prevented from depleting completly, which is another thing that kills the NiMh.
#697 of 711 Re: energy screen [stevedebi]
Sep 19, 2006 (3:22 pm)
"Should" is a big if.
I have learned reading here, nothing will dissuade some from trying to turn a Hybrid into an electric car.