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Hybrid Diesels? - READ ONLY

395 messages,  Last post on Aug 29, 2007 at 7:27 AM

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#353 of 395
Correction, My error by goodcrd
Nov 22, 2006 (7:00 pm)
GM sold off some of it's Toyota holding in late 2005. This has to do with some transfers in Fuji Heavy Industries and other companies. They still have some joint ventures and information sharing agreements. Toyota and GM have been working closely for years. Izusu has been with GM for years. Especially when Detriot Diesel was sold off about ten or more years ago. But I still don't rant!!!
#354 of 395
Re: Cross post alert... [goodcrd] by tpe
Nov 22, 2006 (7:37 pm)

Replying to: goodcrd (Nov 22, 2006 4:13 pm)

I say Honda is all Hype. Treat a Honda the way the average Ford, GM, or Chrysler gets abused and you will find the American cars are more cost effective.
 
Well Americans tend to vote with their wallets. The domestics declining sales and the Japanese increasing sales would seem to contradict that statement. Have we been duped?
 
I'm not bashing US automakers. I believe that they are just as capable of producing exceptional vehicles. Unfortunately they are saddled with financial constraints that interfere with the pursuit of quality.
#355 of 395
Re: Cross post alert... [goodcrd] by kdhspyder
Nov 22, 2006 (10:34 pm)

Replying to: goodcrd (Nov 22, 2006 6:07 pm)

It is a rant because I asked for a reference. Cite a source or a specific holding in GM's portfolio.
 
I know you said it's real just provide a specific source for your information. Then I'll belive you.
 
What you might have heard is that GM holds 20+% of their joint venture in Fremont CA ( possibly ) while Toyota holds 75+% of that plant. But that's the only joint venture.
#356 of 395
Re: Correction, My error [goodcrd] by terry92270
Nov 24, 2006 (2:34 pm)

Replying to: goodcrd (Nov 22, 2006 7:00 pm)

Toyota is more likely to buy GM.
#357 of 395
Re: Correction, My error [terry92270] by goodcrd
Nov 24, 2006 (3:11 pm)

Replying to: terry92270 (Nov 24, 2006 2:34 pm)

People seem to have a very short memory when it comes to Toyota and GM. GM has put the Capital monies up for joint ventures between the two for the best part of the last thirty years. Get intimate with the braking systems and engine on these two manufacturers. You will find some of the engine designs being swapped, sold or shared between the two. What is the I-force engine based on? I may be about 5 years off on the 23%, but you need to know the history of these two. GM is not going away. Different parts of the company yes. Don't be so short sited. GM as far as Hybrids are way ahead. They just don't see a viable market at this time. What penny pinching average Joe is going to pay 6 to 8K more for the same model vehicle and only get about 20% better MPGs. Ok for the slow people 30MPG +20% is 36MPG. Most people can't wait 5 to 10 years to recoup the added costs of the Hybrid system. Look at what price GM is going to Offer the Saturn VUE Hybrid. It will be equal in cost to the Honda Civic. A family can fit in it and still get about 32 on the highway. GM is changing to meet Market conditions. This is just a bump in the road.
#358 of 395
Re: Correction, My error [goodcrd] by terry92270
Nov 24, 2006 (3:26 pm)

Replying to: goodcrd (Nov 24, 2006 3:11 pm)

LMAO!
 
Well, time will tell, won't it? GM's only profitable division is its financial services companies, like GMAC/DITECH. Same with Ford. They will go under with their pension obligations unless they get help. That much isn't in dispute. Perhaps they can turn it around......perhaps.
#359 of 395
Re: Correction, My error [terry92270] by goodcrd
Nov 24, 2006 (5:34 pm)

Replying to: terry92270 (Nov 24, 2006 3:26 pm)

Valid point with the pensions. But one much overlooked and ignored problem is employee accountability when it comes to work performance and quality. The unions don't allow it. Unions will always blame management for not being able to compete. These unions with their unwillingness to allow these companies to compete will put their members out of work just like the Big Steel Mills. I've always believed when you work for someone else you work like your working for yourself. (Now you can say I'm ranting!)
#360 of 395
Re: Correction, My error [goodcrd] by kdhspyder
Nov 25, 2006 (11:41 am)

Replying to: goodcrd (Nov 24, 2006 3:11 pm)

People seem to have a very short memory when it comes to Toyota and GM. GM has put the Capital monies up for joint ventures between the two for the best part of the last thirty years. Get intimate with the braking systems and engine on these two manufacturers. You will find some of the engine designs being swapped, sold or shared between the two. What is the I-force engine based on?
 
Cite specific references, please. Otherwise I do accept your opinion although it may not be factual.
 
I used to sell steel to NUMMI, the JV in Fremont, when it first began so I know a little about the history there. Now if you go back into the 50-60's then yes often people dropped a Chevy engine into an FJ, but that was an aftermarket mod.
 
If you have specific references I'd love to see them. TIA.
#361 of 395
Re: Correction, My error [goodcrd] by kdhspyder
Nov 25, 2006 (11:45 am)

Replying to: goodcrd (Nov 24, 2006 5:34 pm)

These unions with their unwillingness to allow these companies to compete will put their members out of work just like the Big Steel Mills. I've always believed when you work for someone else you work like your working for yourself. (Now you can say I'm ranting!)
 
Now this is true. I was in the steel business for 25 yrs and sold to the Big 3 at that time. The situation of Big Steel is a precursor to what is occuring now with the detroiters. It's nearly the same only 20 yrs later. One other key difference is that it was Americans that killed the old Steel dinosauers. Ken Iverson and his mini-mill innovators were too quick and too efficient for the big mills.
#362 of 395
Re: Correction, My error [kdhspyder] by goodcrd
Nov 25, 2006 (12:23 pm)

Replying to: kdhspyder (Nov 25, 2006 11:41 am)

I don't care about "you" accepting my "Opinion". I'd don't accept yours either. NUMMI was done with GM Capital and Toyota's production practices. So what. Time will tell. Toyota has great PR. Look at the development of Toyota's "I-force" engine and see what I'm talking about. Good Luck.

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