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#1667 of 5290 Civilized debate [sinepman]
May 18, 2005 (1:52 pm)
For you to even suggest that Japan is a third world country truly shows that you don't know what you're talking about.
There are many ways to look at the value of a country. I consider both Japan and Germany close equals. Since WW2 they have prospered financially largely at our expense. They have contributed many good things that we enjoy. They are also being protected by us at no small expense. They may be lovely safe places to live. They are not world powers in the traditional sense.
I don't visit this forum to belittle anyone's choice in vehicles. I enjoy the debate on a civil level, understanding that we all have opinions and many variations on those opinions.
Hybrid technology is in it's infancy as far as mass produced automobiles are concerned. I just don't believe Toyota is being honest about the technology. For example the fellow that is considering trading his 2002 Prius on a new one. If Toyota dealers were interested in furthering the technology they would at least offer the fellow low blue book in trade for a new Prius. They are getting MSRP and making big bucks on the sale. Instead they offer him $5,000 under Low BB. The dealings surrounding the Toyota/Lexus hybrids is too much of a feeding frenzy & media circus to be the good thing, that most people on here consider it to be. It has become way too emotionally charged. They are just cars, that get us from A to B, nothing more. The more efficient the better for all of us.
#1669 of 5290 Re: A Forum of Unchained PittBulls [dewey]
by Kirstie@Edmunds HOST
May 18, 2005 (2:36 pm)
dewey, I'm sorry that some of our members are unable or unwilling to behave in an inviting, civilized manner. I have removed more posts yet again today.
I hope that you will share any news that you come across.
Host, Future Vehicles & Smart Shopper discussions
#1670 of 5290 Re: Civilized debate [gagrice]
May 18, 2005 (2:43 pm)
Gary... there is one thing that is for sure and the dealers have no interest in promoting any new type of technology. All the dealer is concerned with is maximizing profit on each unit they sell. Since the hybrid (unit) is highly desirable, they try and get what the market will bring. They couldn't care less if Toyota is successful with it's hybird lineup. All they are interested in is GREEN (money).
#1671 of 5290 Re: Civilized debate [gagrice]
May 18, 2005 (2:44 pm)
quote gagrice-" I just don't believe Toyota is being honest about the technology."-end quote
What are they dishonest about? They are sharing their technology with basically anyone who asks them for it, competitors too.....what exactly are they being dishonest about?
#1672 of 5290 Re: Civilized debate [larsb]...SHARING?????
May 18, 2005 (3:50 pm)
I think you meant to say...SELLING... and not SHARING..right? Lets face it. Toyota is reaping their technology bonus by selling hybrid works to those getting on the bandwagon. Why not? It Works.
Hybrids for a more efficient tomarrow
#1673 of 5290 Re: Civilized debate [larsb]
May 18, 2005 (3:56 pm)
what exactly are they being dishonest about?
Long term repair expense of the added components in the hybrids. I think they know that this vehicle is going to be very expensive to repair after warranty. If these parts were not sooooo expensive I would consider it normal wear & tear. To have to replace sensors & catalytic convertors on vehicles that are 3-4 years old seems odd to me. Maybe these things go out in all new cars. I know in the case of the catalytic convertor it is a lot more expensive for the Prius than say a Corolla. You will not hear about the components that get replaced under warranty. Nobody complains about that. They are happy they are covered. We are already hearing about people unhappy about big repair bills with first generation Prius.
#1674 of 5290 Re: Civilized debate [gagrice]
May 18, 2005 (4:50 pm)
If people get a bad taste in their mouth due to high repair bills there goes the possiblity of the hybrid going mainstream. Do you think Toyota is going to risk billions and then have no ability to carry sales forward? NONSENSE!!!! The warranty out of the box is quite generous and better than most manufacturers. The hybrid components are warranted for 60,000 miles or five years. Now that the Prius is selling in big numbers Toyota does not want a fiasco on their hands. The press will get wind of it and sales will plummet. You watch and see, repair costs will not be anything approaching what you assume.
#1675 of 5290 Re: Civilized debate [falconone]
May 18, 2005 (4:58 pm)
Aren't the hybrid components warranted for 8 years, and in CAFE states for 10 years/150,000 miles?
I think hybrids will be expensive to repair after the warranty expires. But then, I think almost all modern cars, with their sophisticated electronics and complex mechanicals e.g. 5-6-7 speed automatic transmissions, will be expensive to repair post-warranty.
#1676 of 5290 Re: Civilized debate [falconone]
May 18, 2005 (5:34 pm)
They couldn't care less if Toyota is successful with it's hybird lineup.
As we have seen from a few disgruntled buyers, the Toyota dealership IS Toyota to the buying public. I have only read a couple of instances where the buyers were turned off by less than reputable practices in conjunction with selling the Prius. Those people are lost by Toyota or it would seem they are. I guess I am in the dark on dealing with these guys. I have only bought one new car face to face with a dealer over the last 20 some years. I use the phone and lately the Internet. Going to Tipton Honda was a joke as far as I was concerned. They acted like they were selling the crown jewels. The Toyota guy trying to sell me the Prius in 2000 was very pleasant and I would have bought from him, except for my ex-wife.
My point is the Automakers need to exert more control over the dealerships. If they get complaints squeeze off their supply of premium vehicles.