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Luxury Performance Sedans

9978 messages,  Last post on Nov 02, 2009 at 1:30 PM

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What is this discussion about? Lexus GS 430, Acura RL, BMW 5 Series, Volvo S80, Audi A6, Infiniti M35, Infiniti M45, Mercedes-Benz E-Class, Cadillac STS, Sedan

#9914 of 9978 Re: Lot of Emotion Here [barryend] by art234 May 05, 2009 (12:37 pm)
Replying to: barryend (May 04, 2009 4:44 am) Barry,   Thanks for sharing the experience--I can't wait to get the A4. It will be in hopefully toward the middle of July. I am actually letting my wife drive the M35x until the Audi comes in--the vibration in the drive train doesn't bother her. Then again she does what the dealer recommended -- turns the radio up....
#9915 of 9978 Re: A4 it is [tayl0rd] by lexusguy May 05, 2009 (5:08 pm)
Replying to: tayl0rd (May 05, 2009 8:01 am) Funny how SH-AWD always receives so much praise, even from the rags. Yet when independent performance/handling numbers are published, the TL/RL are always at the back of the pack.   SH-AWD does allow the TL 6MT to be incredibly fast on a track, the numbers don't lie there. Torque vectoring AWD can nearly break the laws of physics, and allow a car that should understeer wildly like a nose-heavy pig to embarrass properly balanced, RWD performance machines.   That said, when it comes to things like road feel, on-center feel and precision, and progressive loading in corners through the steering, and body control and general "tossability", the TL comes dead last, as was evidenced in C&D's recent comparo. The TL may be able to scramble around corners faster, but the driver behind the wheel of a 335i will be having much more fun.
#9916 of 9978 Re: 2007 Acura RL [vavavavolvo] by anon3 May 09, 2009 (6:26 am)
Replying to: vavavavolvo (Apr 23, 2009 4:09 pm) "Your statement that the 5 gets "five stars or a good rating in most other categories in other tests" is simply not correct."   I actually take the time to READ the words in these posts and read the NHTSA ratings. Words have meaning and can be verified. My statement that the 5 Series gets 5 stars or a "good" rating in MOST of the other categories is factual. The NHTSA gave the 2009 5 series 5 stars in 3 of 4 crash tests for passenger sedans. That is "most" and it's a fact, not generalized supposition that tends to substitute for knowledge and experience in this forum.   Like many drivers, you also ignore driving skill, the capabilities of the vehicle, and accident avoidance as a safety factor. Those of us who have spent many, many hours behind the wheel at various tracks and in advanced driving courses know this first hand. Fortunately, Volvo is the perfect car for drivers who rely on the vehicle being a tank to protect them from accidents that they should have avoided in the first place. When you get right down to it... almost every accident is the result of human stupidity, carelessness, inattention, or lack of skill. Personally, I don't believe there are any "accidents". Most are "caused" by driver stupidity and lack of skill.   So I stand by my statement that I will take a BMW over a Volvo any day of the week when it comes to safety. Unlike you, I speak from experience because I own both vehicles and have taken BOTH vehicles through accident avoidance courses. In fact, 3 of the 5 spaces in my garage are occupied by BMWs. So while you may quibble about things that you've read about, I'm speaking from personal hands-on experience. Replies to this message: lexusguy (May 09, 2009 9:25 am) vavavavolvo (May 09, 2009 10:35 am) houdini1 (May 09, 2009 10:40 am)
#9917 of 9978 Re: 2007 Acura RL [anon3] by lexusguy May 09, 2009 (9:25 am)
Replying to: anon3 (May 09, 2009 6:26 am) When you get right down to it... almost every accident is the result of human stupidity, carelessness, inattention, or lack of skill. Personally, I don't believe there are any "accidents". Most are "caused" by driver stupidity and lack of skill.   Well, the word "accident" just implies that whoever was at fault was not intentionally trying to injure the other driver. I've heard the "I've been to a driver training school, or a defensive driving course, I'll never get hit" argument many times before. The fact is that in the real world there are situations where it simply does not matter.   The 5 series does not do as well in a side impact collision as it should. The IIHS gave it a "poor" rating, their lowest, for driver torso protection, and rated it "marginal" overall. Say your traveling through an intersection, and a drunk driver decides to run a red at 50mph and smashes into the side of your car. I don't care how many courses you've been to, your chances of avoiding this type of accident are slim.   The A6 aced the side impact test, as did the Volvo S80. The 5 did not. Your chances of walking away without injury from this type of accident are higher in the Audi or Volvo. That's a fact. I'm not saying it should be the only reason why someone should buy or not buy a car, just that those are the facts and something to consider.   The fact that the A6 aced its front, side, and rear impact tests, and has superb active safety features like Quattro traction and excellent brakes, certainly made my decision easier.   You can apologize for BMW as much as you wish, but they should've done a better job. Replies to this message: vavavavolvo (May 09, 2009 10:35 am) houdini1 (May 09, 2009 10:40 am)
#9918 of 9978 Re: 2007 Acura RL [lexusguy] by vavavavolvo May 09, 2009 (10:35 am)
Replying to: lexusguy (May 09, 2009 9:25 am) Well said.
#9919 of 9978 Re: 2007 Acura RL [lexusguy] by houdini1 May 09, 2009 (10:40 am)
Replying to: lexusguy (May 09, 2009 9:25 am) Very well said.
#9920 of 9978 Mercedes C class lost in the shuffle? by ghstudio May 11, 2009 (2:32 am)
Why doesn't the Mercedes C class get compared to the TL/M/etc? Replies to this message: lexusguy (May 11, 2009 5:09 am)
#9921 of 9978 Re: Mercedes C class lost in the shuffle? [ghstudio] by lexusguy May 11, 2009 (5:09 am)
Replying to: ghstudio (May 11, 2009 2:32 am) Why doesn't the Mercedes C class get compared to the TL/M/etc?   The C Class belongs on the entry level luxury sedans board - along with the TL, 3, A4, G37, etc.
#9922 of 9978 Re: Europe vs. Others [shmang] by markcincinnati May 12, 2009 (2:49 pm)
Replying to: shmang (May 04, 2009 8:29 am) Audi may not be your cup of tea; however, Audis generally and typically receive virtually universal praise for having the best interiors, even if the review or reviewer ends up not being impressed by the overall car.   This is not to suggest that the Japanese or other makers from other countries have poorly designed interiors, etc -- but Audi interiors and switchgear are second to none according to pedestrians like us and the pros from virtually every corner of the globe.   Solid and retro? My dad had a Hudson and a few Chryco cars over the years -- my 2009 Audi interior is anything but retro -- but, it is solid, if that means "substantive." Replies to this message: shmang (May 12, 2009 4:59 pm)
#9923 of 9978 Re: Europe vs. Others [markcincinnati] by shmang May 12, 2009 (4:59 pm)
Replying to: markcincinnati (May 12, 2009 2:49 pm) By retro, I mean classic. Did I mention heritage in my post. The interior for Audi is very nice - especially the new ones (Those from 2006, 2007 are not that impressive, especially w/o navigation system).   But, that does not mean the interior of Infiniti or Acura is cheesy. They are modern, fashion with distinct style that is targeting younger people, while Audi and MB, BMW are targeting more towards 40+ people (except those low end sporty models - we are talking about luxury performance sedan here).   So, don't get me wrong. I am not saying one is better than the other, it is just targeting different market group.

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