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Luxury Performance Sedans

10094 messages,  Last post on Feb 28, 2010 at 7:34 AM

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What is this discussion about? Lexus GS 430, Acura RL, BMW 5 Series, Volvo S80, Audi A6, Infiniti M35, Infiniti M45, Mercedes-Benz E-Class, Cadillac STS, Sedan

#8722 of 10094 Re: From the FBMI (Federal Bureau of Miscellaneous but not true Information) [markcincinnati] by rockylee Nov 13, 2006 (4:40 pm)
Replying to: markcincinnati (Nov 13, 2006 1:04 pm) OMG, you and sfcharlie are to funny. My stomach hurts after all the laughing I just did.   Rocky   P.S. I'm a STS guy.
#8723 of 10094 Re: Since we moved from prices to performance... [cstiles] by clanline Nov 14, 2006 (10:59 pm)
Replying to: cstiles (Oct 29, 2006 2:11 pm) What is your role in the Auto Industry, if you don't mind my asking? Sounds like you're seeing quite a bit of future trends from Japan. I'm particularly interested in #7 on your list. How does the Toyota Active Head Restraint function? Did Toyota develop it themselves? How does it work? Sounds very cool! Other than WIL, what does Toyota have out in the marketplace in the Lexus line-up you mentioned? Replies to this message: cstiles (Nov 16, 2006 5:24 am)
#8724 of 10094 Worth considering? by markcincinnati Nov 15, 2006 (1:31 pm)
My A6 is hardly unique, but it is equipped with all the options other than TPMS and sport suspension -- what would be called Premium, Technology and Convenience were it an '07.   My build date car has what must be Windows XP Pro Svc pk 2 (or whatever MMI goes by.)   It was built, as I recall, in May 2005.   It was, apparently, the "last or near last" 2005 in terms of its MMI version.   Since the day I acquired it, it has had a feature that I have not really been bothered by but it I told Audi about it anyway: the Surround Sound mode (on CD and Sat Radio) reverts, periodically, to "normal" (i.e., non-surround mode.)   MMI, likes Windows for a PC, controls everything, essentially. Because this -- for me at least -- was not a big deal, I figured "what the heck" and forgot about it.   Audi puts on a training school in Columbus, Ohio for all the senior people in Ohio (and perhaps southern MI and western PA and KY) dealerships. I got a call and they said, "you have one of the cars that has so many features and functions and is of such and such an MMI version that we now can totally upgrade your car and teach all the folks in the "REGION" at the same time. You'll get a new MMI software upgrade AND we'll let you use a new Audi at our expense and our gas, etc for two days.   They have been good to me, so "why not?"   "How about a W12 for 2 days. . .no no, wait, how about an RS-4, no no, wait, what I really want is an S6 for two days, the white one with all the toys on it on the showroom floor?" Can I huh? Can I huh?   "We'll see. . ."   Now I knew the RS4 and W12 were right out and they did say "Mark, you can sit in the S6 and make engine sounds with your mouth!"   They know I would simply not acquire a V10 Audi without winning the lottery or deciding my marriage was worth sacrificing (which it isn't.) They know I know that, I know they know that, and so on.   "We'll get you a nice Enterprise PT Cruiser. . ."   Ahhh, no, that won't do. . .   "How about an A4 3.2?"   Naahhhh, rather have an S4.   I pull in to turn my car over to them for training and education and they trot out a $65K Q7 with a full tank of gas and literally all the toys and a 4.2 W/the adaptive air suspension and 20" wheels and I swear dual rear seat bidets.   My wife and I had test driven an early build non adaptive air model w/18" wheels several months ago.   Give me a wide, wider, widest berth and blow the fog horn, this ocean liner is about to dock!   What a pleasant and powerful and darn near sporty surprise!   This thing, set to dynamic suspension mode with the 20" shoes is damn near nimble.   I am impressed -- probably not enough to want one or lease one (unless the price was impossibly low.)   This is quiet, comfortable, responsive and feels nothing at all like the QE3!   Now maybe if they made a Q6. . .
#8725 of 10094 Re: Since we moved from prices to performance... [clanline] by cstiles Nov 16, 2006 (6:24 am)
Replying to: clanline (Nov 14, 2006 9:59 pm) I am connected to the vehicle technology and testing arm of a very large property & casualty insurance company, along with its internal/external research division.   Toyota's active head restraint system is currently not that far ahead of what other Japanese companies offer (and in fact, the most current versions have only received middling scores from IIHS and other testing centers.) However, Toyota is ahead of everyone else in terms of what is under development. They are also taking their current scores as a source of embarrassment, and seem serious about hitting it out of the park in future tests.   They showed us some prototypes, and they are mechanically constructed of moveable head restraint foundations that pivot forward to protect the head when triggered by a rear collision. They are also working on seat back hinges that will deform to better contour against the spine and neck of the passenger(s). Toyota is ahead of the pack in terms of coupling such features with front and rear radar detection systems that allow the car to electronically anticipate a potential crash. They are also ahead with comprehensive systems that tie in collision mitigation (ABS, TCS, electronic overrides) capabilities.   Finally, due to its resources, Toyota is a key player in the safety infrastructure that Japan is testing and building that will allow cars to "communicate" with external traffic flow monitoring sensors, other cars in the vicinity, bicycles, or pedestrians whose locations can be approximated. Toyota is also creating in-car sensors that are supposed to detect when a driver may be falling asleep or not being attentive, by monitoring ambience and movements inside the car. Nissan is also a player in these arenas, but Toyota clearly leads the way and is an influencer to others.   Some of this smacks of big brother, but the sheer creativeness of what the Japanese are noodling to reduce collision frequency/severity is quite impressive. Several of the insurance company executives in attendance at the meeting were joking(?) that if the Japanese are successful, they may eliminate the need for insurance companies!   That's not such a bad concept, I suppose.
#8726 of 10094 Re: VW and Audi [lansdownemike] by sfcharlie Nov 16, 2006 (8:16 am)
Replying to: lansdownemike (Nov 13, 2006 6:40 am) "facile comparisons of "the Germans" or "the Japanese" just don't hold any more. As you note, Audi is very well represented among the "highly recommended" (good drivers, reliable, good crash tests), and not a single MB is even "recommended."   I resents the allegation and I resents the allegator -- seriously, though, I don't think that referencing places where CR or JDP suggest that readers should expect better reliability from Japanese cars is the same as making facile comparisons between German and Japanese cars.   Yes, CR does highly recommend many Audi models and I'm delighted. Equally interesting is that when CR asked owners if they were likely to buy a similar model from the same manufacturer in the future, the four luxury cars for which at least 80% of owners said "yes" were Infiniti M35 (which had been out only a couple of months at time of survey), Lexus GS, Lexus LS, and Audi A6. In the "sporty car" category, the BMW M3 was nowhere to be seen, but the Audi S4 was there.   Nonetheless, even Audi management has made statements about their need to overcome the bum-rap they had gotten from 60-Minutes, the frequent merging of VW and Audi in the mind of the consumer, and the late 1990s through 2000 engine problems.   The also have October 2006 reports such as their "The problem with new models: Think twice about buying a newly designed model in its first year", in which they draw attention to average problem rates, by manufacturer, for newly designed 2000 through 2002 models. Some readers are going to see that every brand rated "above average" is Japanese and BMW is the worst.   Most of us, on this forum, are not going to be influenced by that sort of data about six year-old models, but some CR readers will be. The comparing of Japanese and non-Japanese cars continues in the press. Pointing to its existence is not an endorsement of its statistical or real-world value, but it is a part of the literature on cars that draws a lot of attention when the reports come out.   Worldwide, Audi is doing great. Here in the U.S. they need more advertising to let people know of the quality and excitement of their current line-up.
#8727 of 10094 Customer Service by warthog Nov 20, 2006 (5:24 pm)
I have a 2003 530i (E39) with about 37,000 miles. Recently the "Service Engine Light" came on, although I didn't notice any performance problem. I took it in for service a couple days later, expecting some minor problem. The service rep called later saying the readout codes indicated a torque converter problem and they would either reprogram the tranny or replace the converter. Fine. I got a loaner X3.   The next day the rep called to say that they had emailed the codes to Munich and their recommendation was to replace the torque converter. Fine.   The day after that, Munich recommended replacing the entire tranny, not because of any current problem, but because it might go bad 20K miles down the road due to whatever torque converter problem they had found, and it would be out of warranty at that point.   Now maybe there's some self-serving BS in all this, but still I'm pretty satisfied with BMW's service: I get a new transmission for free, while driving a free car during the fix.   How many auto makers would do this? Replies to this message: james27 (Nov 20, 2006 5:11 pm) lexusguy (Nov 20, 2006 5:31 pm)
#8728 of 10094 Re: Customer Service [warthog] by james27 Nov 20, 2006 (6:11 pm)
Replying to: warthog (Nov 20, 2006 4:24 pm) On my 98 A6, I had a problem that I noticed right after I brought it home. They actually sent some techs from the factory over from Germany to take it apart and analyze the problem. While this was going on, they gave me a new A6 to drive...most of the manufacturers of the LPS ilk I think tend to do the same thing...fix it right.
#8729 of 10094 Re: Customer Service [warthog] by lexusguy Nov 20, 2006 (6:31 pm)
Replying to: warthog (Nov 20, 2006 4:24 pm) Now maybe there's some self-serving BS in all this, but still I'm pretty satisfied with BMW's service: I get a new transmission for free, while driving a free car during the fix.   It's definitely nice to see them take the initiative to keep your car running right, rather than band-aid the problem and set up the service department for a nice "bonus" 20K miles later.   On a Lexus, I can pretty much guarantee you that the "check engine" light means that the oxygen sensor has failed. Unfortunately, out of warranty its about $500 or so for a new one.
#8730 of 10094 Audi, safe at first by domenickamarc Nov 21, 2006 (2:48 pm)
I know "safety" hasn't been a major concern of this forum, but ti's in the news today, so:   "Imported models took all 13 spots on the U.S. insurance industry's list of safest vehicles this year ... Winners for the 2007 model year included the Audi A6 in the large car category; the Audi A-4, Saab 9-3 and Subaru Legacy (with optional stability control) for mid-size cars; the Hyundai Entourage and Kia Sedona minivans; the Mercedes M-class and Volvo XC90 luxury SUVs; the Acura RDX, Honda Pilot and Subaru B9 Tribeca mid-size SUVs; and the Honda CR-V and Subaru Forester small SUVs. All 13 vehicles are tops in protecting people in front, side and rear crashes based on institute tests during the year." Replies to this message: cstiles (Nov 21, 2006 2:46 pm) markcincinnati (Nov 21, 2006 3:38 pm) cstiles (Nov 21, 2006 6:56 pm)
#8731 of 10094 Re: Audi, safe at first [domenickamarc] by cstiles Nov 21, 2006 (3:46 pm)
Replying to: domenickamarc (Nov 21, 2006 1:48 pm) Yes, but the poorest head restraint scores also went to imports, so there's work to be done....note Infiniti M in the "poor" category for whiplash protection (ie: seat/head restraint design).   And it may be unprecedented to see Avalon and Sienna both rated as "poor" for protection in a rear crash. The standards for these tests are obviously very tough since I'd feel safe in virtually any of these models. For example, for a vehicle to receive the highest rating, it must also offer ESC.   Acceptable rear protection Audi A3 BMW 3-series 4dr Lexus IS 250/350   Marginal rear protection Acura TL Honda Odyssey Lexus ES 350 Lexus GS 350 Toyota Camry Toyota FJ Cruiser Toyota Prius Toyota RAV4   Poor rear protection Honda Accord 4dr Infiniti M35 Nissan Quest Toyota Avalon Toyota Sienna Replies to this message: markcincinnati (Nov 21, 2006 3:38 pm) cstiles (Nov 21, 2006 6:56 pm)

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