Last post on Nov 25, 2013 at 11:27 AM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Lexus GS 430, Acura RL, BMW 5 Series, Volvo S80, Audi A6, Infiniti M35, Infiniti M45, Mercedes-Benz E-Class, Cadillac STS, Sedan
#8699 of 10348 Re: Horsepower forum? [fonefixer]
Nov 08, 2006 (2:15 pm)
I work with people who have Acura's, BMW's and several other brands.
I would say that BMW's are breathtakingly expensive to repair out of warranty.
Some friends have a Lexus -- it is "largely" bullet proof.
However, the owner tells me little wear and tear items are also breathtakingly expensive and keep going out.
The phrase "overall the Lexus is very reliable, but it tends to nickel and dime you" leaps to mind.
Had dinner with our friends last week and they do love their Lexus -- but as soon as the warranty was over the tire pressure monitors go out. Somehow, someway, the system itself needs some parts, the wheel sending device and of course the labor to dismount and remount and WHAM the better part of $1,000 is shot.
I mentioned my friend with a 56,000 mile old BMW and its $900 for the FRONT rotors and brake replacement since BMW requires 100% replacement of everything and this was just for the fronts.
The list of breathtakingly expensive stuff just goes on and on.
Conversely, another friend and co worker has a 2000 Chevy pick up truck -- the big one with 4WD, leather and power everything.
He has had the mufflers go out twice and the tires go out twice and the "power window regulators" go out twice.
The thing, by comparison, "takes a lickin' and keeps on tickin'" -- he has well over 100K miles on the truck and it actually looks good, rides good and sucks gas, but that is nothing new.
I know all the "we're not worthy, we're not worthy" evidence pertaining to Lexus and perhaps Infiniti.
The cost of "CPOing" is generally $1,000 to $1,500 -- it just seems like money well spent.
Moreover, if you are use your car about 16,666 miles per year for three years and factor in all the potential, possible and probable "normal" repair costs, precipitous depreciation (especially of LPS cars) and thrown in sub-venting from the leasing arms of a lot of these imports, well, it is clear they were never intended to be purchased in the first place (they were intended to be leased, loved and left at 50K miles or sooner, i.e.)
I grow weary sometimes -- especially as I age and time goes by so quickly -- since I have, at this moment, found a car I would like to keep (my 2005 A6 3.2) until the wheels turn square.
But, the truth of the matter is, my lease payment is $640 and change every month. My sec dep was waived, and my wakin' out costs including the first mo pay were less than $1,000 and Audi financial forgave my last three payments on my 2003 allroad (which were about $750) -- so much as I want to keep my "flawless and fun to drive" 2005 A6 3.2, it will probably be cheaper to walk away at about month 33 or 34 and walk into another new (German or Japanese) LPS car.
And the hell of it is, I really like this car probably better than almost any other car I've had.
But, as I have said, I am almost certain I would be saying the same thing had I moved forward with the Infiniti that I "came this close" to leasing.
I sometimes wonder if it would be possible to make cars like software, that is, allow a new release of "parts" of the car, the electronics, the instrumentation etc, to allow one to continuously evolve the car over a much longer period.
For the life of me, I just can't see how keeping this Audi (or any LPS car for that matter) can be made to work what with the lease payment options regularly and routinely subvented as they are.
One more thing, there are still some very nice 2006 A6 Slines sitting around with "-$7,500" off sticker signs on them which, when coupled with the aforementioned lease programs makes buying one incomprehensible (to me at least.)
So, perhaps I will "get the itch" again in 15 months -- I don't seem to have much choice since Cincinnati isn't noted for its vast subway or street car system.
"I can't drive 55"
#8700 of 10348 Re: Horsepower forum? [markcincinnati]
Nov 08, 2006 (5:26 pm)
Your remark about the $900 front brakes on a 56,000 mile BMW, is, rather simply, "breathtaking"! I just changed out the original front brake pads on my 86,000 mile TOY camry, and while I did do the job myself, the parts cost was $42.00. The rotors were fine and should last until the next pad replacement. Auto repair truly is one of the last frontiers in this country, except that the frontier has a starting line , but no ending point.
I think I'm more irritated by the general inconvenience of all the Audi repairs over the last 6+years ,i.e., sometimes taking 2 to 3 weeks for completion. I bought the extended service plan on my replacement Mazda Cx-7 for $1350.00 which covers the second 3 years/50,000 miles. Hoping the plan will need minimum usage and that I'll only be a visitor to the Mazda dealer for routine services.
Understanding that you are satisfied with the A6,buying this type of car at the end of the lease, even adding the extended warranty, probably doesn't make a lot of economic sense.To add insult to injury, many Audi potential owners do not realize all the extra expenses that "pop up" between 36 and 100,000 miles that aren't included in the service plan that wouldn't normally occur in the first 3 years of average leased driving.
#8701 of 10348 Re: Horsepower forum? [fonefixer]
Nov 08, 2006 (6:43 pm)
"Your remark about the $900 front brakes on a 56,000 mile BMW, is, rather simply, "breathtaking"! I just changed out the original front brake pads on my 86,000 mile TOY camry, and while I did do the job myself, the parts cost was $42.00."
Hmmm, well I did all for wheels on my 328i, rotors, pads and sensors included for less than $250. Apparently Camrys aren't alone in the low cost brake job world.
#8702 of 10348 Re: Horsepower forum? [markcincinnati]
Nov 08, 2006 (7:42 pm)
It`s too bad WE have to wait fifteen months, as I, for one ,really enjoy your multi page report on your new car..Your joy really comes through in your writing..Tony
#8703 of 10348 Mazda versus Audi reliability? Something odd here.
Nov 08, 2006 (9:37 pm)
We've been talking about Audi and Mazda as if it's a matter of fact that the average Mazda has had significantly fewer problems than the average Audi.
In the 2006 JD Powers Vehicle Dependability Study, both Mazda and Audi were listed as having been well below average. The average Lexus, Buick, and Cadillac were reported to have had about 1.5 problems during the first three years, while the average Mazda had about 2.5 and the average Audi had 2.8.
Disclaimer: I love Mazdas and we own one and it's a kick to drive -- one of the best buys among small cars in terms of fun for the buck. My favorite Japanese brand. I wouldn't at all mind owning a CX-7 and would actually prefer it to a Q7, but because it's sportier, not because I assume it will need fewer repairs.
Nonetheless, there is no statistical evidence to suggest that a disgruntled 2000 Audi owner will spend less time at the service department with 2007 Mazda than with a 2007 Audi. Emotionally, however, switching brands when you've owned a lemon seems like good therapy to me.
#8704 of 10348 Re: Horsepower forum? [shipo]
Nov 09, 2006 (5:37 am)
My 2002 530i SP 5sp still has over 50% of the pads remaining. My brake job cost is $0 plus two brake fluid replacements.
#8705 of 10348 Re: Horsepower forum? [fonefixer] Audi woes of biblical proportions
Nov 09, 2006 (7:18 am)
many Audi potential owners do not realize all the extra expenses that "pop up" between 36 and 100,000 miles that aren't included in the service plan that wouldn't normally occur in the first 3 years of average leased driving."
We have to update the prediction of "the weeping and the gnashing of teeth" for potential Audi owners to read: Many Audi potential owners do not realize all the extra expenses that "pop up" between 50 and 100,000 miles that aren't included in the service plan that wouldn't normally occur in the first 4 years of the new 4 year, 50K manufacturers warranty.
#8706 of 10348 Re: Horsepower forum? [fonefixer] Audi woes of biblical proportions [domenickamarc]
Nov 09, 2006 (7:45 am)
And from what I can tell, we need to add Acura, BMW, Cadillac and Lexus to the list.
Having said that, my in-laws have a "flawless" 1997 Cadillac (the big one with front wheel drive.)
It has perhaps 70,000 miles on it and yes it has had new tires and brake pads and maybe even rotors, but basically the car -- such as it is (i.e. a front wheel drive sofa on wheels) is in perfect condition.
Is it MILES or is it time that is the enemy?
And as a follow on, we seem to NOT have many STS participants herein -- are the buyers of such vehicles not into blogging with other LPS folks? Are the STS drivers lurking and laughing at us Euro and Japaense LPS folks with our "breathtakingly expensive" to maintain cars?
I actually drove an STS at least two times, and I thought it was a member in good standing of the LPS crowd -- at least if optioned appropriately to put a bit more "P" into the equation. . . .
#8707 of 10348 Re: Horsepower forum? [530ir1150r]
Nov 09, 2006 (9:07 am)
"My 2002 530i SP 5sp still has over 50% of the pads remaining. My brake job cost is $0 plus two brake fluid replacements."
That's also how it works with 2001-2006 Audi vehicles (all of which came with included-in-purchase-price replacement of normal-wera items such as wiper blade inserts, brake pads, clutch lining and light bulbs and also includes wheel alignment, wheel balance and headlight adjustments. Runs for 4 years or 50K and costs $500 on 2007s.
#8708 of 10348 Re: Mazda versus Audi reliability? Something odd here. [sfcharlie]
Nov 09, 2006 (9:46 am)
I purchased the Mazda Cx-7 having no idea about the frequency of repairs. I'm mostly covered for 6 yrs/100,000 miles, but as far as trips to the sevice bay, who knows?
Even so-called "highly rated" vehicles like Toyota can have serious repair issues. I know a mechanic who bought a Toy Rav-4 3 years a go and after 6,000 miles, the engine seized up due to lack of oil pressure. Toyota refused to cover the repair claiming the oil changes weren't done through a Toyota dealer and the mechanic stopped making the payments, therefore the vehicle was repo'd!
Despite my individual problems with the Audi brand, indifferent dealer service really pushed me to another model. Old fashioned customer service may be alive and well with many dealers, I just didn't get to that level through Audi.