Last post on Nov 25, 2013 at 11:27 AM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Lexus GS 430, Acura RL, BMW 5 Series, Volvo S80, Audi A6, Infiniti M35, Infiniti M45, Mercedes-Benz E-Class, Cadillac STS, Sedan
#8208 of 10348 Re: Follow-Up Test:BMW 550i From Edmunds [hpowders]
Aug 24, 2006 (6:03 pm)
Trolling nes't pas? Okay, I'll bite.
Reasons why I got a MB E350 instead of a BMW 530i:
Caveat: I would have leased a 530i if the damn dealer had not been such an ass. I like 5's but the ridiculous offer made me by the dealer gave me time to look around at lots of other cars. I never would have thought of the Benz but thank god the Beemer dealer was an ass. I digress:
1. There is no iDrive and everything can be directly controlled without menus. - And I'm a computer guy.
2. In my opinion the materials used in the MB are of higher quality.
3. The E with its seven speed tranny feels faster to me and is actually slightly faster.
4. The E sport suspension is not as harsh as the 5 sport suspension and you don't have run flat tires.
5. The E series has been given a face lift for 2007 and in my opinion looks better than the 5.
6. The 5 series will be replaced in the next year while the revised E will be with us for almost two years.
7. The E series sport package which is a no additional cost package. It brings brings great looking ten spoke 18" wheels with 245 and 285 tires, a sport suspension that sits lower, ventilated and drilled discs, finished brake calipers, blue tinted glass, body side ground effects, perforated leather sport seats, "black" wood trim, and some external trim changes. It really transforms the car - I'm not sure if I hadn't seen it that I would have gotten the Benz.
8. There are a lot more 5's around here thanks to the 525 which is a great deal but which makes 5's common.
9. If you get the premium packages with the MB you get everything you could possible want including upgraded stereo, nav, satellite radio, electric sunshade and my favorite, keyless entry which is alone a $1000 option on a BMW. Any you don't have to pay $1,800 for the BMW "premium" package which doesn't bring anything to the table the base E350 does not have. The only options available outside the packages are the panoramic roof, parktronic and distronic cruise control. Did I mention that the six disc CD changer was standard. I have as available audio Sat radio (which has been a very pleasant surprise), regular radio, CD, CD changer and my iPod (extra cost of course) available.
10. You get a full set of side airbags that you should have in the BMW but you cannot get without having to order the car.
11. With everything, the list on the MB was less than the 5 even though it was much better equipped.
12. The intangible - There is a serenity and comfort driving the Benz. I felt more frantic driving the 5. I can actually stay in one lane most of the time. I have other vehicles should I feel the need to be more frantic.
13. Insurance through State Farm Mutual is less.
expensive - I'm told because MB has a better safety record.
Downsides: BMW has the full maintenance program. MB has gone to a fixed price menu of services, and gives you the first service for free, but you can't beat the BMW plan that even includes brake pads.
I can't talk to the car - it has zero voice commands. Actually it is an option. On the other hand it has a dial pad readily available along with all other controls. While both cars can talk to a Treo through bluetooth, neither will recognize your address book.
The BMW sport seats are some of my all time favorite seats.
BMW's seem to have a better reputation for reliability and this seems to be the main wild card.
Aren't you glad you asked? IMHO either is far away and above the Japanese competition and this is from a guy coming from a Japanese car.
Keep the rubber side down.
#8209 of 10348 Re: Follow-Up Test:BMW 550i From Edmunds [mbbrooks]
Aug 24, 2006 (6:14 pm)
I have the comfort seats in my 545, which IMO are better than the sport seats-more adjustments and wonderful side-bolstering. As good as it gets.
The E Class is very fine too, and you will get no argument from me that the European LPS vehicles are superior to their Japanese counterparts, although the Infiniti M is a fine effort in the LPS class.
You think the 530i is "frantic." Imagine yourself in a 545.
When you floor it, it has got to have the most intoxicating sound outside of a Porsche.
#8210 of 10348 Re: Follow-Up Test:BMW 550i From Edmunds [hpowders]
Aug 24, 2006 (7:57 pm)
530i is probably more "frantic" than 545i due to much lower torque and the need to rev. The field of V6's are moving to 3.5 liter (or turbo in the case of BMW) for that very reason.
#8211 of 10348 Re: Everything [dhamilton]
Aug 24, 2006 (11:11 pm)
I have read and heard is that Honda/Acura is a small but very profitable company. I hope they can get some platform/driving dynamic things worked out. I really doubt it's a budget problem. I think it's more of an entrenched mentality that says if it ain't broke [financially speaking] then don't fix it.
To me, small but profitable sounds like Porsche. Honda has more than enough resources to make a V8, a dedicated RL\TL platform, etc. It sounds like this will start happening in the next decade or so which should help Acura become a more than a 3rd tier player.
#8212 of 10348 Re: Follow-Up Test:BMW 550i From Edmunds [mbbrooks]
Aug 25, 2006 (4:15 am)
This post, single-handedly, ought to make almost any LPS shopper who has not yet made a decision on one of these fine cars we go on about, at least consider an MB.
Very well put!
#8213 of 10348 Re: Follow-Up Test:BMW 550i From Edmunds [hpowders]
Aug 25, 2006 (4:20 am)
From the takes all kinds notebook:
To a man and woman (in the BMW sales department) at our local BMW dealership, there is a disdain for the "uncomfort" seats.
The salesrep gives me the keys to a 530xi and says "this was a special order, and the guy changed his mind -- the only reason we still have it is those damned comfort seats. No one can get them to fit -- despite umpteen different positions the thing can be moved into."
Now, when I drove the car, I guess I was swayed, becuase I thought the seat cushion was "off" under my thighs.
Takes all kinds.
#8214 of 10348 Re: Follow-Up Test:BMW 550i From Edmunds [markcincinnati]
Aug 25, 2006 (5:14 am)
That's strange. Many people, myself included, find the comfort seats to be among the most comfortable around.
But, because of the incredibly large amount of interacting setting possibilities, one has to have the patience and the time to find the combination of settings that is just right.
Believe me, there is a correct combination for everybody.
One can't expect to find this combination in the dealer's showroom.
I particularly like the thigh extender and the great side bolstering which is as fine as that included with the best sport seats.
I spent an hour or so with the driver's seat. But, once you find the right combo, you input it into the seat memory button and the key and that's that.
Sort of the same with the iDrive-you spend some time inputting your personal settings and then forget about it.
The only fly in the ointment is if I have to take the car in for servicing and they turn the car "off."
I imagine I would have to start the process all over again from scratch.
That is why before I go to bed, I not only say a prayer for my family and friends, but also, that my BMW will never need anything more than a simple oil change and no "diagnostician."
#8215 of 10348 Toyota Quality
Aug 25, 2006 (6:24 am)
Toyota May Delay New Models To Address Rising Quality Issues
NEW YORK (The Wall Street Journal)--Toyota Motor Corp., jarred by a surge of recalls and quality problems, is considering tapping the brakes on its ambitious growth plans, delaying introductions of some new models by as much as half a year, people familiar with the matter say.
Toyota has been accelerating its growth world-wide and moving to overtake General Motors Corp. as the world's No. 1 auto maker. In May, the company said capital expenditures in the current fiscal year would reach a record of roughly $14 billion. But the fast-paced expansion has come with a cost: an increasing number of quality problems in North America, Japan and elsewhere that threaten to dent its quality image.
It will be interesting to see if these quality issues impact current Lexus offerings, given the more complex nature of the LPS models.
Another interesting development relates to JD Power's recent release of vehicle dependability ratings after 3 years' ownership. Ironically, many of the top rated vehicles are either no longer sold (Echo, MR2, Celica, Century, Sable, Park Avenue, DeVille, T-Bird) or are under quality scrutiny at present (Tundra, undergoing its 2nd recall in 2 yrs).
Goes to show that ratings like Power and CR have its shortcomings also.
#8216 of 10348 Re: Toyota Quality [cstiles]
Aug 25, 2006 (7:42 am)
It's not JD Power's fault that vehicle quality tends to improve late in the production cycle. There was an old joke about GM being in the business of discontinuing products just when they finally have fixed all the problems
Aug 25, 2006 (1:24 pm)
about small,profitable with regards to Honda/Acura, However, when you compare them to their direct competition, Nissan/Infiniti, Toyota/Lexus, Audi/Volkswagen they are smaller. Porsche doesn't fit in to the conversation.