Last post on Nov 25, 2013 at 11:27 AM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Lexus GS 430, Acura RL, BMW 5 Series, Volvo S80, Audi A6, Infiniti M35, Infiniti M45, Mercedes-Benz E-Class, Cadillac STS, Sedan
#7498 of 10348 Re: Mark - Brakes A8 [rayainsw]
Jun 08, 2006 (11:26 am)
The A8 was not plagued with brake rotor issues that would merit much discussion.
Two A6 4.2's (a 2000 and a 2001) however, went through 9 (NINE) sets of rotors during my ownership experience with them.
The dealer and AUDI worked with me -- I was never without transportation and I can and will admit to levels of ebbing and flowing frustration over this situation.
During this period of time, I had the chance to drive cars from several manufacturers and the "shudder" (indicating warped rotors, or so I thought) was "rampant" during those years.
I did keep the faith, so to speak, possibly (probably) longer than other folks might have given similar experiences.
My A8 did have some issues, but the brakes don't stick out as major problem ares. In fact nothing was a major problem, but I did have to have the power steering column replaced (twice), the booties that are full of a smelly liquid on each wheel also had to be replaced as they leaked and did cause lots of odor as the liquid was burned off during braking.
I dunno, maybe this latter problem caused some brake issues. Nothing compares to the 9 sets of rotors on the A6's. The 1999 A6 had fine brakes, the allroad, ditto, my wife's 3 TT's and 3 A4's were fine, too.
My 2005 C6 A6 has great brakes -- great pedal feel, never any shudder or wobble.
Overall, brakes in the newer cars are fantastic.
I may or may not have shared my BMW 325ix (1988) experiences. New rotors and pads at 30,000 miles -- "routine" or so we were told.
Perhaps my loyalty has been bought (or was) because throughout all the crap that happened, I never was without transportation and there was no oop cost.
Perhaps, today, I would not be as tolerant.
My issues, in perspective and hindsight, were never so bad as to make me leave the brand.
OTOH, I never had had experience with Lexus or Honda or fill in the blank cars to compare to.
My previous experience had been with Chrysler products and they were always in need of repair or maintenance and did not offer the joy of driving that the Germans provided in abundance.
I tolerated the issues because the driving experience had, in my mind, no peer. I took the bad, so to speak, to enjoy the exceptional.
To repeat: that was THEN, this is NOW.
My tolerance is probably lower these days -- but, hell, as I age, I am also shorter!
#7499 of 10348 Current Sedan Re: Ray- [clpurnell]
Jun 08, 2006 (11:33 am)
Briefly (since this does not fit the LPS criteria) . . .
2005 Pontiac Grand Prix GXP.
Amazingly smooth powertrain.
( But FWD - though very well managed, IMHO. )
Torque & more torque.
Lovely heterodyne beat of a small block V8 exhaust. ( yum )
Well screwed (welded, glued, bolted) together - at 15,000 miles.
Surprisingly supple ride - with Bilstein dampers.
Not perfect, and not equipped to the Luxury level generally seen on an Audi
But an absolute, screaming bargain at 'Employee Pricing for Everyone' plus a $2K rebate - 1 year ago.
Some additional details are in my year review - posted here on that board.
Something interesting & entertaining to drive while I watch these 'Interesting Times' in the automotive realm unfold . . .
Waiting for exactly the right LPS, at exactly the right price – for me . .
#7500 of 10348 Re: Perhaps I'm an anomaly. . .(rant) [sfcharlie]
Jun 08, 2006 (12:23 pm)
I would not take c.r too seriously...I have found them to be behind the trend line....All information is of value to an extent, but to base a final decision on something that does not excite you---you will regret...As hpower has said ` maybe I`m looking on the wrong road`...Well I can say` I am on the same road as he`...Tony
#7501 of 10348 Re: Reliability [zidecar]
Jun 08, 2006 (1:05 pm)
.....a much more troubling impression of M car than CR did: moonroof rattles, a bad speaker in the seat (which would require tearing the leather seat apart to fix), headlight beams that point too low, loose driver seats.......
Note that the moonroof rattle was a design flaw found in the early builds of the M. I immediately noticed the problem and took my new M back to the dealer. Not only did the service manager and dealership owner bend over backwards to help me but Infiniti sent over some engineers from Japan to look at my car. They gave me a $300 gift card for my troubles, fixed my car, immediately issued a TSB (photos of my car!) plus ordered a fix at the factory so no cars after the first few months would have the same problem. Do you honestly think any other manufacturer would have done anywhere near the same? Infiniti wants this car to be the best and have shown a willingness to listen to the customer. Keep in mind it's a brand new design with almost no brand loyalty.
I've driven 18K miles in the past 14 months with no other issues. My local Infiniti dealer also comped my 7.5K service. I did have to pay the $255 bill for the 15K service. By the way I'm averaging 18.95 mph for a 50/50 mix driving.
I too have previously owned a BMW, Lexus and MB. Based soley on my ownership experience (and chatting with other owners and managers in the respective service departments), I would still rate the Lexus as best but Infiniti is close. I have to own the Infiniti for a few more years to see how things play out. BMW was below average - I would still buy another however no way would I own it pass the warranty period - so leasing is the way to go - plus they sub vent their leases. (Note Infiniti is doing the same with their leases... where did they get the idea?). The MB proved to be a real POS. I will never own one of their cars again! For that kind of money I was expecting a whole lot more.
Keep in mind none of these cars as a whole are bad. Probably 90+% of BMW owners have no problems (including everyone on this forum) so I can see how many would have no problems with three or four cars. But then again if you compare it to 98+% of Lexus owners with no problems - well then you can see how some would rate the Lexus as more reliable. Of course if you're one of the unlucky 10%, well life sucks. I'm happy for all the car owners on this forum who have no problems. I don't wish for any car owner to suffer. Believe me, I've met some of those 10% and they weren't happy campers.
#7502 of 10348 J.D. Powers Initial Quality Results
Jun 08, 2006 (1:12 pm)
Based on surveys received from car owners evaluating their first 90 days of ownership.
2. Lexus - 93 problems per 100 vehicles
7. Cadillac - 117
7. Infiniti - 117
10. Acura - 120
Industry Average - 124
25. MB - 139
27. BMW - 142
Let the spinning begin.....
#7503 of 10348 Re: J.D. Powers Initial Quality Results [drtravel]
Jun 08, 2006 (1:17 pm)
There's already a discussion about the merits (or total lack thereof) of the new IQS report in the HELM thread. The problem with the new study is that it focuses on design issues as well as defects, so BMW is being hurt because of iDrive, not necessarily because their cars are having problems.
#7505 of 10348 Re: J.D. Powers Initial Quality Results [drtravel]
Jun 08, 2006 (1:24 pm)
So, in my case, since in the first 90 days I had TWO new pushbutton starter replacements, that would have counted as "2" -- and if 99 other customers had reported the same experience, the number would be "200."
If the industry average is 124 per 100, which means, I presume, 1.24 problems on average per car for 90 days, I enjoyed problems worse than all of these cars.
Funny, I guess, even though I can recall these issues, I would in casual conversation (with no intention of hiding anything) say that my 2005 A6 which will soon be 13 months old has been "virtually" flawless.
My perception, my reality -- even though technically the problems I described (which did extend to 4 total pushbutton starter switches before it was apparently fixed permanently) really don't bother me very much at all -- when adjusted to be factually accurate means I have had a lousy 13 month run, despite the fact that my impression is otherwise.
#7506 of 10348 Re: Reliability [drtravel]
Jun 08, 2006 (5:47 pm)
I have a newer production M45 (4 months old, 5k miles) and today I discovered the roof rattle!! (However, it turned out to be my sunglasses in the roof holder )
Seriously, so far the car has been flawless; the service knowledge less so. I'm coming from a series of MB's (E430 / E55 / E500) and before that Lexus. This car is consistently the most fun of the group, although the Lexus LS400's were completely trouble free and the dealer service was incredible. Hope Infiniti lives up to them in the former area and improves in the latter department.
#7507 of 10348 Re: J.D. Powers Initial Quality Results [lexusguy]
Jun 08, 2006 (6:10 pm)
From msg #7503: "The problem with the new study is that it focuses on design issues as well as defects, so BMW is being hurt because of iDrive, not necessarily because their cars are having problems."
One website I googled upon broke down the results and BMW did not only suffer, in ranking, from design ("we don't like how iDrive works") complaints, but also defects and malfunctions: