Last post on Nov 25, 2013 at 11:27 AM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Lexus GS 430, Acura RL, BMW 5 Series, Volvo S80, Audi A6, Infiniti M35, Infiniti M45, Mercedes-Benz E-Class, Cadillac STS, Sedan
#5625 of 10348 Re: Interesting [jpmorgan]
Dec 28, 2005 (11:36 am)
Wow, I never would have seen that one coming! The E350 did what that the 530xi didn't?
When we were testing the many and various cars we were looking at to replace our 2003 Audis, we always walked away from the Mercedes saying "that was a really really nice car -- but pretty low on the driving dynamics scale."
We never walked away from the BMW feeling that way.
Walking away from the BMW we often remarked, "can't someone marry the performance of the BMW with the classic luxury of the Mercedes?"
Then the Mercedes rep told us that "4Matic" meant All wheel drive+automatic transmission. At BMW they told us you can shift for yourself or we can do it for you -- ultimately at the exact moment in time we placed the order for the new BMW, the Audi only offered an auto, ditto the Mercedes, but BMW allowed and encouraged the most dynamic performance of all the Germans.
Now, at age 54 (and my wife is 51), the other comment was "we're not OLD ENOUGH to go for the Mercedes." Of course that is tongue in cheek, but Mercedes seems to emphasize the driving experience less.
We thought the Mercedes was better suited to a Cadillac comparison or perhaps Lexus than it was going up against the 5 series. Unfortunately, at that exact moment in time when I was plunking down my commitment, no 530xi could be had -- so I went with the most dynamic and best value of the lot, the M35X -- and then, as you may know, Audi of America came in at the 11th hour with a deal on a new A6 that was "an offer I couldn't refuse."
Please share your perceptions and how you came to this apparently happy but difficult (for some of us) to follow decision. Thanks.
#5626 of 10348 Re: Interesting [markcincinnati]
Dec 28, 2005 (12:00 pm)
I'm guessing because the E350 is probably much quicker than the 530xi and it has a 7-speed auto. And it's a Mercedes!
#5627 of 10348 Re: Interesting [markcincinnati]
Dec 28, 2005 (12:07 pm)
Very interesting, Thank you very much. Justed ended liking the E350 more. Simple as that, Don't have the passionate responses or justifications you seem to have. I don't need to convince myself nor anyone else I didn't make the wrong choice. These car are all great. I was just sharing my observation regarding the RL/Accord comparison and how the A6/Passat is similar. Congratulations on your choice.
#5628 of 10348 Re: Interesting [jpmorgan]
Dec 28, 2005 (12:38 pm)
If you care to elaborate what features, feelings, attributes, etc, contributed to "liking it more."
You certainly don't need to justify anything to anyone here, it is a matter of curiosity and seeing that this week feels like a lot of dead air, perhaps you have the time to expound.
#5629 of 10348 Re: Interesting [markcincinnati]
Dec 28, 2005 (12:51 pm)
I find it interesting that he was concerned about reliability and mentioned that with the RL, yet bought a Mercedes, a company with known issues of late.
I too have looked at the E350, but now live in an area with awd isn't as big a priority. Just thought the drive wasn't as exciting as our 325 was. The MB was a decent car, but the interior doesn't seem to have that certain luxury feel that MB's used to have years ago. Maybe it is the plastic... I dunno. Something about it just didn't give me the feeling that it was a solid car. But that is just how I felt about it. YMMV.
#5630 of 10348 Re: There Is Nothing Quite As Wonderful As Reversals! [markcincinnati]
Dec 28, 2005 (1:06 pm)
If you are passionate about cars then rationality dictates that you buy/lease a car every two to three years." Now that, it seems to me is a rational statement.
Buying a car every two to three years is not rational. If you are passionate about cars then it becomes easy to rationalize purchasing or leasing a new car every two to three years. But that does not mean it is rational.
We all have our own personal ways to rationalize our actions. . .since when is passion necessarily irrational or, as I interpret your sentiments, undesirable?
In my opinion there is dualism between passion and rationality! In your opinion passion and rationality are intertwined especially in the case of cars. This is the source of our disagreement and the disagreements of philosophers in past millenniums when they discussed their chariot purchases.
Oops wrong forum. I better go back to my Plato forum.
#5631 of 10348 Reason and Passion
Dec 28, 2005 (1:17 pm)
I think you are arguing from two different perspectives. Classically, rationality (reason) is from the head, while passion is from the heart. In that sense, passion and rationality are two separate forces. However, it doesn't necessarily follow that a passionate choice cannot be the rational choice as well.
Mark may be saying that if you are passionate about an automobile, getting it may also be the rational choice if you are otherwise going to have regrets (outweighing other practical/rational concerns).
As to classic Descartes dualism, I will add: I post, therefore I am. Many will attest that thinking (at least on my part) has nothing to do with it.
(the future's so bright...I gotta wear )
#5632 of 10348 Re: Interesting [jpmorgan]
Dec 28, 2005 (1:48 pm)
I don't think anyone here is asking you to justify your decision. This is a group of folks who are into lively conversation about the luxury performance sedans and, as someone else mentioned, the E-Class really hasn't had a "voice" here, so to speak. So I think folks were excited that your choice and the fact that you posted here would give them a chance to hear about it.
I hope you'll join in - it's all good fun here, honest!
#5633 of 10348 Reason and Passion . . . "deep thoughts," indeed (by Jack Handy)
Dec 28, 2005 (2:05 pm)
LPS cars perhaps more than many other cars seem to almost require passion -- they go way beyond logic and reason don't you think?
The entire thread of most if not all of the musings here (that I read anyway) are opinions. That is why it is so entertaining and engaging to participate herein.
I was simply reversing two words "as if" that made it somehow MORE than opinion. I have no thoughts that such word play made either statement have the requisite verisimilitude for "truth."
"Gotta have it. . . gotta have it" is many LPS buyer's mantra I suspect. I would assume that is the part of growth that is above the needs for food, clothing and shelter and is perhaps part of the hierarchy of needs called "self-actualization."
A lot of us rationalize our LPS purchases for there are darn few practical reasons for lusting after and acquiring these vehicles.
As I said and/or meant of my opinion: I would use a word such as loyalty to describe the buy and hold behavior while I would use the word passionate more to describe "the seeking of the next" (aka getting a new one every couple or few years.)
I do not think much of what we discuss here is rational, perhaps it barely qualifies as logical.
I just found it personally entertaining to reverse the words from the original post, which, despite all this fuss I essentially understand and agree with.
BTW I love the phrase [somewhat modified for widespread dispersion] "I blog, therefore I am. . ." consider it disseminated on the WWW.
#5634 of 10348 Re: Don't know if this is true or not. . . [hpowders]
Dec 28, 2005 (5:26 pm)
The more technologically complex these LPS vehicles become, the greater the argument in favor of 2-3 year leasing.
You'd certainly think that greater complexity should lead inevitably to higher repair costs, but my experience suggests otherwise.
The 2 least reliable cars I ever owned were a '78 VW Rabbit & an '80 Audi 5000. By today's standards, these were ridiculously simple machines. No power windows, seats or mirrors, no automatic transmissions, no high-end stereo systems. Needless to say, no ABS or VSC; those had not yet been invented. Hell, the Vee-Dub didn't even have A/C. (It was my last car without it.) But those cars came close to making me a pauper. I laugh about it now, but it wasn't funny at the time.
By contrast, my wife's '99 Lexus should be a nightmare. Power everything plus stuff like ABS, stability control & a CD changer that no one had even thought of back in 1980. It should be a maintenance nightmare, but my total repair costs since the warranty expired nearly 3 years ago wouldn't cover my cable bill for 4 months. (Nope, I don't have an "extended warranty". Don't believe in them.)
Does higher complexity = higher out-of-warranty repair costs? Not necessarily.