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What is this discussion about? Lexus GS 430, Acura RL, BMW 5 Series, Volvo S80, Audi A6, Infiniti M35, Infiniti M45, Mercedes-Benz E-Class, Cadillac STS, Sedan

Messages Page 538 of 1034

#5371 of 10338 This talk of numbers. . . by markcincinnati

Dec 06, 2005 (2:55 pm)

. . .I had my curiosity aroused by some of the monthly US sales reporting that folks dutifully report here on-line each month.
 
Not that sales figures listed from highest to lowest are all that revealing. . .because no context is (and maybe cannot be) given.
 
For instance, if X sells more than Y by 100% but has 3 times the number of retail outlets, well, that says one thing. If X sells more than Y and they have the same number of outlets, that says something else -- for instance.
 
As the numbers and ancillary information become more and more integrated, a truer picture of what sales figures suggest beyond the obvious emerges.
 
So with my trusty Google tool bar I searched for a few minutes and came up with this concatenation of "data."
 
==========
 
12/2005:
 
BMW global sales have surpassed those of Mercedes-Benz this year, according to Germany’s Automobilwoche. BMW expects to have sold 1.317 million cars by the end of the year, while Mercedes says it will have sold 1.23 million. So far, BMW sales are up 11 percent, and Mini sales are up 12 percent. Mercedes Group sales are up just 1 percent through September. Meanwhile, Audi is expected to surpass 1 million units globally in 2006 or 2007 for the first time in the brand’s history.
 
Audi sold almost 767,000 vehicles worldwide between January and November, an increase of 8.8 percent on the corresponding prior-year period. Around 69,700 vehicles were handed over to their new owners in November, 2.0 percent fewer than in the same month last year. However, 2004 saw the market launch of the Audi A4 in November and, before that, the A3 Sportback. Both of these launches ensured an exceptionally strong November in 2004.
 
More than 23,000 vehicles were handed over to customers in Germany in the past month (up 2.5 percent; November 2004: 22,458). The sales volume up to the end of November therefore totalled around 230,500 vehicles, 8.5 percent more than in the same period in 2004 (January to November 2004: 212,483).
 
The best November sales figures ever were recorded in the USA: a total of 7,909 vehicles were sold, representing an increase of 15 percent on last year (November 2004: 6,879). The Audi brand consequently sold 74,224 vehicles in the USA in the period January to November. This represents an increase of 5.6 percent on the previous year (January – November 2004: 70,267).
 
“A particularly pleasing aspect of the figures is that they represent increasing market shares. With 4.2 percent in Western Europe, we have achieved a record market share for the Audi brand,” commented Ralph Weyler, AUDI AG Board Member for Marketing and Sales. “In Germany, too, we are 0.4 percentage points better off than last year, and have attained a market share of 7.5 percent.”
 
Now, somewhere, there must be a current data point about the "market share" of these three brands in Germany. I thought I had read somewhere that these three brands went tit-for-tat against each other, recently with Audi beating BMW who then beat Audi and so forth at the expense of Mercedes.
 
Audi includes Audi, BMW includes Mini, who knows what Mercedes includes. The point is, should Audi be lumped in with VW to indicate the broader top to bottom sales (as does BMW when it lumps Mini in with "regular" BMW)?
 
Nothing, presumably would be proven by such a snapshot of market share -- but it seems to me that it would at the very least be an interesting exercise.
 
Of course, then it would be interesting to note Cadillac's US sales against, for example, the BMW's and somehow come up with a market share figure of these brands.
 
Then, to fully boggle the mind, how about a comparison of # of dealerships, etc to determine just how bad things REALLY are at the General.
 
Note: I still rather doubt that numbers alone will prove that one is "better" than the other, but it would do wonders in helping understand the likely "survivability" of, say, GM, in a given market, geography and segment.

#5372 of 10338 Re: Exactly! [drtravel] by bjbird2

Dec 06, 2005 (3:04 pm)

Replying to: drtravel (Dec 06, 2005 9:30 am)
It seems many of the posters on this forum are self declared "experts". Some scoff at the magazine "experts", and then they expect us to take their personal opinions as "expert", and disregard the professionals.

#5373 of 10338 Nav by jimbres

Dec 06, 2005 (3:23 pm)

It's worth noting that the geek web sites - CNET comes to mind - have an entirely different take on auto nav systems. The received geek wisdom is that the current generation of nav systems is so laughably primitive that only a fool would invest more than a few hundred dollars - preferably in a portable unit (a Garmin, for example) that can be easily replaced when the next big thing comes along.
 
Mind you, I'm not saying that I agree with this, although I do have a Garmin that I move among our 3 cars & that I find adequate to the task. It's quite possible that I would opt for a factory system if I were to buy an LPS tomorrow - mainly, because they look so cool. But this is a common POV among the tech-oriented web sites, & it is something to think about for those of us who buy (as opposed to lease) our cars & hang onto them (as I do) for 5+ years. Perhaps we long-termers might be better off with a low-cost (my c330 cost $550) non-built-in solution.

#5374 of 10338 Re: Exactly! [bjbird2] by hpowders

Dec 06, 2005 (3:37 pm)

Replying to: bjbird2 (Dec 06, 2005 3:04 pm)
I don't recall anyone on this thread ever declaring that he was an "expert." If you go back through the 5373 posts on this thread, you will find quite a few "I am no expert..." statements.
Unless someone was being sarcastic to make a point (like: "Oh yeah. You're the expert!"), you will find that nobody on this thread has ever come out and declared himself to be an expert on any of the cars we talk about.
 
 

#5375 of 10338 Re: Exactly! [bjbird2] by drtravel

Dec 06, 2005 (3:47 pm)

Replying to: bjbird2 (Dec 06, 2005 3:04 pm)
It seems many of the posters on this forum are self declared "experts". Some scoff at the magazine "experts", and then they expect us to take their personal opinions as "expert", and disregard the professionals.
 
I'm an expert, but I'm just not sure on what?? That's a fact!!
 
Just waiting for the defensive denials to come in....

#5376 of 10338 Wake Me Up When... by hpowders

Dec 06, 2005 (3:48 pm)

The navigational system storm clouds clear.

#5377 of 10338 Re: Exactly! [drtravel] by hpowders

Dec 06, 2005 (3:51 pm)

Replying to: drtravel (Dec 06, 2005 3:47 pm)
Why, on irritating me, of course!

#5378 of 10338 Re: Exactly! [hpowders] by warthog

Dec 06, 2005 (4:29 pm)

Replying to: hpowders (Dec 06, 2005 3:37 pm)
People can disclaim all they want, but it's clear enough that several frequent contributors consider themselves to be authorities, albeit with the usual politically correct demurrers. At least the mags give facts and figures, presumably not fudged. The reader can decide for himself whether the data support the conclusions of the writers. The only figures usually seen in this forum are sales figures, as though that means anything about the merits of the cars in question.

#5379 of 10338 Re: Exactly! [hpowders] by jjacura

Dec 06, 2005 (4:40 pm)

Replying to: hpowders (Dec 06, 2005 3:51 pm)
a little trace of Paranoia setting in there ...I think DrTravel likes you...If you can dish it out you gotta be able to take it...what you sow you're gonna reap.BLAH...BLAH ...BLAH
 
Now if I can just set aside a little more time to comprehend Mark's last post.....GEEZ....and I thought I was good with numbers... IT Takes an EXPERT I guess!

#5380 of 10338 Re: Exactly! [warthog] by jjacura

Dec 06, 2005 (5:03 pm)

Replying to: warthog (Dec 06, 2005 4:29 pm)
I enjoy reading these forums as well as the magazines and pretty much get from each what I expect to find...but I am regularly entertained, informed, and even amazed sometimes by the points of view in here.

Messages Page 538 of 1034

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