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Luxury Performance Sedans

10007 messages,  Last post on Dec 01, 2009 at 7:40 AM

You are in the Sedans Forum. Your Hosts are pat & karens

What is this discussion about? Lexus GS 430, Acura RL, BMW 5 Series, Volvo S80, Audi A6, Infiniti M35, Infiniti M45, Mercedes-Benz E-Class, Cadillac STS, Sedan

#2022 of 10007 More on AWD... by kyfdx HOST May 05, 2005 (5:35 am)
I will say... What is really nice about the latest crop of AWD, is the cars default operation is basically RWD, with the fronts only kicking in when needed.. I think this gives better handling and better road feel... I know this is the way the Infiniti and the new 5-series work... I think the Lexus is the same way... Not the case with the Acura, though....
#2023 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? (maybe jrock65) [jrock65] by ksoman May 05, 2005 (7:17 am)
Replying to: jrock65 (May 03, 2005 11:47 am) If you consider that this is the begining of a new life for both Acura RL & Infinity M, then Acura definitely missed the boat here.   I might be a little honda partial, even though I don't own one, but when I saw the RL & M on the floor of the NY auto show last year, I knew already that RL was going to have a miss even though to my eyes the RL & the M look remarkably similar except for the ugly details, which I think are ugly on both cars....   As a current BMW owner, I'm amazed how well BMW is doing on the 5, for better or worse... the name sells, even though I can personally vouch that "ownership experience is closer and closer to hell".   And yet, everytime I sit behind the wheel of the bmw, I have this instant smile on my face, that as yet, no other car/make puts on my face...   my confused 2 cents... ksso Replies to this message: kyfdx (May 05, 2005 7:26 am)
#2024 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? (maybe jrock65) [ksoman] by kyfdx HOST May 05, 2005 (7:26 am)
Replying to: ksoman (May 05, 2005 7:17 am) At the Cincinnati auto show, the RL, M and GS were all sitting within 50 feet of each other.. Any one of the three could have been mistaken for the other, depending on the angle... The only advantage I can see for any, is that the Lexus and Infiniti can be had with RWD and a V-8, if you want to go that way.. If you are looking for AWD and a V-6, you could flip a coin (a three-sided coin?).   My BMW experience (3-series) has been good, so far .... 29K miles... It puts a smile on my face, when my wife lets me drive it...
#2025 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? Update +Audi [nebraskaguy] by ksoman May 05, 2005 (7:26 am)
Replying to: nebraskaguy (May 04, 2005 1:59 pm) "A coworker had a 5 series that he got rid of after the first winter here in DC. He only had one way out of his development and it was up a slight hill. If we got even 1/2" of snow, he couldn't drive it. He says he'll never buy another RWD car until he retires to Phoenix. "   As somebody who moved from Phoenix to the northeast in the last year odd, i'll say, all it takes to drive a rear wheel drive in the snow is a good set of snow tires.   if you can spend 50K on a car, i think you can afford to spend a thousand bux on a good set of winter tires... no?   ksso Replies to this message: markcincinnati (May 05, 2005 9:46 am) ksoman (May 05, 2005 1:21 pm) ksoman (May 05, 2005 1:33 pm) warthog (May 05, 2005 1:42 pm) richcream (May 05, 2005 1:43 pm) nebraskaguy (May 05, 2005 3:53 pm)
#2026 of 10007 Re: markcincinnati, kyfdx [lexusguy] by markcincinnati May 05, 2005 (9:44 am)
Replying to: lexusguy (May 04, 2005 9:03 pm) While I believe there will be a market for pure RWD cars for some time, I also believe that the cars that will ADD AWD will be RWD (mostly). Sure, the Acura FWD becomes an AWD, but virtually all of the Mercedes and THE biggest selling BMW's are already AWD and as far as I know never were FWD.   The biggest reason for AWD from a FWD perspective is, as you have identified, our current capability to add HP and Torque to engines that can be put in relatively inexpensive cars.   The shift from FWD to RWD is often accompanied with an "option" to be AWD, too (Chrysler 300C, Cadillac STS, for example).   Pure two wheel drive (front or rear) is probably not destined to be replaced entirely by AWD, but the direction does appear to be AWD being the growth part of the market (and if you add SUV's to the "car" mix, the AWD or 4WD equipped vehicles are growing faster than some of the car manufacturers had predicted).   Now with asymmetrical AWD being adopted by Audi -- we have pretty much "validated" the thought that rear-biased AWD will pretty much keep grabbing market share.   I keep hearing the Subaru ads on the radio -- they now are touting Subaru symmetrical AWD -- I know the public, or a lot of the public, is completely clueless.   "Gee Fred, this company says they've got symmetrical AWD and that one says asymmetrical AWD -- which one of these is better than the other? Beats me Mary, I always thought that asymmetrical means not equal, so I guess that would mean symmetrical is better. Fred, you're so smart. . . ."
#2027 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? Update +Audi [ksoman] by markcincinnati May 05, 2005 (9:46 am)
Replying to: ksoman (May 05, 2005 7:26 am) Or one more thousand to have the car come with AWD and keep the high performance All Season tires on year round. Replies to this message: ksoman (May 05, 2005 1:21 pm) ksoman (May 05, 2005 1:33 pm) warthog (May 05, 2005 1:42 pm) richcream (May 05, 2005 1:43 pm) nebraskaguy (May 05, 2005 3:53 pm)
#2028 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? Update +Audi [markcincinnati] by ksoman May 05, 2005 (1:21 pm)
Replying to: markcincinnati (May 05, 2005 9:46 am) i disagree on that... i see too many 4 wheel drive cars in the ditches here in the northeast to believe all seasons with awd/4wd are safe enough for most of the snow, safer than rwd or fwd with all seasons? absolutely, but safer than a awd with winter tires, not even close...   i've actually gotten out of a snow pile with the bmw rwd with snow tires (it's a 3 convertible, so there's no option to get a awd there yet) and failed to get my A6 quattro with all seasons out... comparing apples to apples, because both of them were caught in the same snow pile up in my drive way this year.   ksso Replies to this message: ksoman (May 05, 2005 1:33 pm) warthog (May 05, 2005 1:42 pm) richcream (May 05, 2005 1:43 pm)
#2029 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? Update +Audi [ksoman] by ksoman May 05, 2005 (1:33 pm)
Replying to: ksoman (May 05, 2005 1:21 pm) reminds me of long ago when we lived in apartments in new york city. the superitendent would turn up the heat in november and not bother to shut it off till spring time. it got freaking hot, so we would keep the windows open in the middle of winter, to compensate for the excess heat. rather than adapt to changing day to day environments, we were seeking alternatives to overcome the laziness of the super.   its just like that with winter tires. summer, you got temperatures from 80s to 100s and you expect the same tires to work with you with a different surface cor and different temperature gradient... i dont think awd has as yet eliminated (reduced yes, but not eliminated) fundamental problem of lack of adhesion....
#2030 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? Update +Audi [ksoman] by warthog May 05, 2005 (1:42 pm)
Replying to: ksoman (May 05, 2005 1:21 pm) And of course, AWD has no advantage if you're using the brakes.
#2031 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? Update +Audi [ksoman] by richcream May 05, 2005 (1:43 pm)
Replying to: ksoman (May 05, 2005 1:21 pm) Please stop - you're making me second guess my decision to get the M35x for the NY winters.   Oh how I yearn for the M45....335hp....340lb ft of torque.....5.3 seconds to 60......mmmmm, donuts ***gargling/drooling Homer Simpson-like sounds***.   C'mon Mark, expound upon the virtues and superiority of AWD and clear my conscience!   If not: 1) how much do ya think the dealer would be willing to give me on a (2 week old) trade in? "Financial bloodbath" probably wouldn't suffice to describe the loss I would incur, percentage wise. 2) how would you feel about 500 miles and XM?   Oh well... I guess I'll just have to "suffer" with the 35x's paltry 280hp. I wish it would snow (just once), as it would make me feel a tad bit better. Right now I have to wait at least 7 months to enjoy my "X" justification....barring terrential downpours that is.

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