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Luxury Performance Sedans

10007 messages,  Last post on Dec 01, 2009 at 7:40 AM

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What is this discussion about? Lexus GS 430, Acura RL, BMW 5 Series, Volvo S80, Audi A6, Infiniti M35, Infiniti M45, Mercedes-Benz E-Class, Cadillac STS, Sedan

#1965 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? (maybe jrock65) [drtravel] by cheerioboy26 May 03, 2005 (11:48 am)
Replying to: drtravel (May 03, 2005 8:45 am) edit: jrock posted as I was typing
#1966 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? (maybe jrock65) [jrock65] by markcincinnati May 03, 2005 (12:38 pm)
Replying to: jrock65 (May 03, 2005 11:47 am) I presume Audi has not released figures yet?   I also presume STS incentives are doing the trick? Replies to this message: bartalk3 (May 03, 2005 2:06 pm) markcincinnati (May 03, 2005 5:58 pm)
#1967 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? (maybe jrock65) [markcincinnati] by bartalk3 May 03, 2005 (2:06 pm)
Replying to: markcincinnati (May 03, 2005 12:38 pm) Mark,   Are there incentives on the STS? All I've seen is 5.9% financing. Replies to this message: markcincinnati (May 03, 2005 5:58 pm)
#1968 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? (maybe jrock65) [jrock65] by bartalk3 May 03, 2005 (2:18 pm)
Replying to: jrock65 (May 03, 2005 11:47 am) If someone tried to predict real world sales from comments on this board, they would fail miserably. Big surprises, considering consensus opinion here:   5, E, and STS are selling surprisingly well. Why is 5 selling so well??    (I also think Lincoln LS sales are surprisingly high--jrock, do you have this?).   More surprises: STS and GS selling better than M.   No surprise: RL coming in last. Acura, however, must be shocked, shocked, especially after C&D included it in the 10 Best Cars in the World shortly after its introduction (but before the M and GS debuted). Replies to this message: docnukem (May 03, 2005 5:33 pm) drtravel (May 03, 2005 6:02 pm) cstiles (May 03, 2005 6:36 pm)
#1969 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? (maybe jrock65) [bartalk3] by docnukem May 03, 2005 (5:33 pm)
Replying to: bartalk3 (May 03, 2005 2:18 pm) Is anyone really that surprised? If you ask around at most places of work, I would bet that only a small minority subscribe to any auto mag. I would bet that even fewer would know about web sites like Edmunds or the car connec...something.com.   The average buyer has heard about Mercedes and Cadillacs all their life. During the 80's, BMW established such an image of being upwardly mobile that they are just as easily recognizable. I would bet that most people who buy a Jag like the look and the name, but don't care too much about performance (unless they shop for the R versions)--my wife is one; she loves the look of the S and I would have felt guilty not getting one if the rear seat had had more room.   With Lexus being (relatively) much newer and Infiniti being just as new but out of the spotlight in recent years (until the G35, then the FX, and now the M). These are just below many people's radar. Replies to this message: drtravel (May 03, 2005 6:02 pm)
#1970 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? (maybe jrock65) [bartalk3] by markcincinnati May 03, 2005 (5:58 pm)
Replying to: bartalk3 (May 03, 2005 2:06 pm) Here in River City the newspapers are replete with $7,000 OFF of the new STS.   Maybe that is a local incentive.
#1971 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? (maybe jrock65) [docnukem] by drtravel May 03, 2005 (6:02 pm)
Replying to: docnukem (May 03, 2005 5:33 pm) When I was in the Mercedes waiting room (fixing yet another problem with the car) I would chat with other customers (who had the same quality issues) and many wouldn't even consider looking at a Japanese car. Probably the same with BMW. Fact is that a BMW or MB owner will likely replace their car with another BMW or MB. Image is everything here.   The M will do fine over time - it will probably increase sales just like the G which started out slowly but has increased in sales every year since. In order for Infiniti to compete with Lexus they need a winning Q45. The LS has been such a fine (and good selling) automobile - it carries the entire Lexus fleet. So even though many believe the G is superior to the ES and the M is superior to the GS - no one believes the Q is superior to the LS. Infiniti needs to win the flagship car competition and enjoy the spillover effect on their other models. Plus they need a catchy slogan. The "relentless pursuit of perfection" or the "ultimate driving machine" are ingrained in many minds here.   The GS has a history of starting out strong and then fading away. There was such a pent up demand for the car (it was due last year) that sales will be strong for awhile. There was NO demand for the M so I'm pretty sure Infiniti is happy with their sales so far. Will be interesting to see how these sales figures change over the next year or two.
#1972 of 10007 luxury performance sedans by xkss May 03, 2005 (6:26 pm)
Incentives are not advertised on Cadillac's website for the STS.
#1973 of 10007 Re: Anyone have April sales figures? (maybe jrock65) [bartalk3] by cstiles May 03, 2005 (6:36 pm)
Replying to: bartalk3 (May 03, 2005 2:18 pm) Although obviously Honda would prefer to see RL sales higher, I'm not sure if they are shocked with their results so far. Compared to the previous model, RL sales are actually up nearly 200%. The fact that the previous RL was such a dog, and basically appealed to a very different customer base (retired, almost dead, or non-enthusiast), it will take a couple of years to regain their position alongside the elite.   I think it's also more relevant to compare RL sales to the 6-cylinder versions of the M, GS, STS, and 5. That would still likely put the RL in last place (since something like 75% of luxury cars are sold with a 6-cylinder), but this car really doesn't compete with 8 cylinder models.   Regardless, RL sales will likely end the model year somewhere between 15,000 and 16,000 sales, which I believe will be below their stated target of 20,000.
#1974 of 10007 drtravel by lexusguy May 03, 2005 (7:11 pm)
Oh I'm sure Infiniti is quite pleased. The new M sells more a month than the old M was doing in a year. If they can work the same magic with the FM platform into a new Q, and get the styling right, it will be like the spiritual successor to the original Q45, before Nissan started back pedaling and trying to compete with the LS400.   While a majority of MB and BMW customers would probably thumb their noses at Japan, you can only punish your customers so much before they start leaving. I've known more than a few people who were stranded in Benz and BMW and traded them for reliable Acura and Lexus.   Keep in mind that the G and ES are not really competitiors. The G competes with the IS300. Infiniti tried mostly in vain to compete with the ES with the '96 I30. Unfortunately they never realized that the ES is not a Camry with a fancy coat of paint, and thats always what the I was, which is what killed it. It most likely would've died anyway. The I30 was a product made during Infiniti's "lost years" where the company literally had no focus and couldnt decide what kind of cars to make, so they just put out barely modified Maximas and Pathfinders.   Lexus is certainly well aware of the GS's tradition of being a flash in the pan. Thats why this time they are planning continual upgrades during several model years rather than leaving it alone for 8 years like last time. Replies to this message: cstiles (May 03, 2005 8:00 pm)

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