Last post on Nov 25, 2013 at 11:27 AM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Lexus GS 430, Acura RL, BMW 5 Series, Volvo S80, Audi A6, Infiniti M35, Infiniti M45, Mercedes-Benz E-Class, Cadillac STS, Sedan
Apr 22, 2005 (1:00 am)
Interest last few days on this board. I don't think its the materials in the 5-Series that are the blame totally. If you ask me BMWs have always been bare and plain looking on the inside for as long as I can remember and their materials were always good, but never the main focus. Now since they've changed the layout from the cockpit theme everyone is noticing the materials more. Just my theory. I've always thought BMW had the worst looking interiors of the three German luxury makes, but they were always functional and when driving you didn't care about how they looked because the experience was so enjoyable. The only BMW that I thought really had truly plush materials were the 7-Series, and then only from 1995 onward. All imo of course.
#1761 of 10348 Re: BMW [merc1]
Apr 22, 2005 (1:54 am)
As far I can tell, the interior materials and design of the previous generation 5's and 7's were identical. The 5 was merely a shrunken version of the 7 interior.
#1762 of 10348 Re: BMW [warthog]
Apr 22, 2005 (2:28 am)
True the designs were the same, but the 1995 7 was the plushest BMW I'd ever seen/been in up to that point. I mean it was downright plush for a BMW I thought at the time. Gathered leather and all. I don't think the materials between the two were the same though.
#1763 of 10348 Re: BMW [merc1]
Apr 22, 2005 (3:25 am)
I fully agree with your opinion about BMW interiors.
#1764 of 10348 Infiniti 4wd system
Apr 22, 2005 (3:45 am)
"For comparison, none of the G35X's German competitors are capable of this. The Audi A4 quattro can transfer up to 50% of the engine's torque to the rear wheels; the Mercedes-Benz C-Class 4Matic up to 60%; and the BMW 330Xi up to 62%."
#1765 of 10348 Re: brand loyalty
Apr 22, 2005 (3:54 am)
I understand you very well, markcincinnati. I was (almost) as loyal to CitroŽn as you has been to Audi, and for 28 yeas too. I never excluded other brands, however. I did short excursions into other fruits in between 5 "lemmons" (CitroŽn is an old French word for lemmon). It happened that CitroŽn was always a good compromise between price and performance, here in my place, and I came back to it with joy. Guess my first car? A second hand BMW Issetta. That was really fun and painfully slow. It was not exactly a luxury performance sedan. I never thought of being a yuppy while driving it.
#1766 of 10348 Re: BMW [merc1]
Apr 22, 2005 (4:12 am)
I beg to differ about the 5 vs. 7 interiors. A good friend has a '95 740 and I have a '03 530. Both have the gray leather interiors. The leather is the same material, so far as we can tell, and is pleated in the same way. The door and dash materials are identical. In fact, the only differences are that the 7's center console is wider and has more controls, and the dash being wider, the side air vents are on the dash instead of in the doors.
#1767 of 10348 Re: BMW [warthog]
Apr 22, 2005 (4:19 am)
You know what, you're right I'm thinking about the previousx2 5-Series the 1989-1995 model not the 1997-2003 model, yep the two you mention did have the same style of interior, but that 7-Series was first to market so thats why it sticks out to me. I remember the previous 5-Series coming to market in spring of 1996 as a 1997 model. I'm thinking about the 535i from the late eighties.
Your post only confirms why I think a lot of folks don't like the new interiors. Even from the 1989 to the 1997 5 the interiors didn't change radically. They had the same bare, cockpit style layout which everyone got so used too. This is one reason why I think the new 5 causes so much shock. Combine this with the urge to really notice the interior materials (since the cockpit feeling is gone) and bam you have folks not liking BMW's new design motif. The 7-Series was basically the same theme from 1988 and 1995, only it got plusher to me.
I personally don't have a problem with it as it still to my eye looks very plain and BMW like though everything is more upright and straight. To me it still looks like a old-school BMW especially around the climate controls and the other few switches left. They just took out the driver focused angling of the dash/ upper center console imo.
I've always found Mercedes and Audi interiors to be far better looking than BMWs.
Apr 22, 2005 (4:49 am)
"I've always found Mercedes and Audi interiors to be far better looking than BMWs."
We're definitely in agreement there. Audi didnt impress me much in the early '90s, but by the time the previous gen A6 was introduced, they had the best of the bunch.
#1769 of 10348 Re: Infiniti 4wd system [mariner7]
Apr 22, 2005 (6:15 am)
The Audi system can "transfer" up to 50% of the power to the front or rear?
The Audi system STARTS at 50% f 50% r power distribution and via an instant acting (not virtually, not electronically but mechanically instant) Torque Sensing (TORSEN) AWD set up can send additional power to the front or rear depending on where the most traction is.
For purposes of this explanation, I am speaking specifically of the TORSEN quattro set up, not the Haldex quattro set up. However, the quattro intent is to shift more or less power forward or backward regardless of the technology used. The TORSEN system (today) is nominally a 50-50 set up. Upcoming TORSEN set ups will be nominally 40% f 60% r biased (basically to remove the issue of not being an RWD biased AWD system from the discussion).
Depending on the model (and application), the quattro system will send up to 75% of the power to the front or rear based on traction.
According to Audis own literature, the ability to pinpoint a single wheel that can benefit from additional torque is also part of the system: "[Under normal conditions] power is split 50/50 front to rear. But in extreme cases up to 67% of the engine's power can be directed to a single wheel. The benefits to the driver are safety, performance, power, and control in copious amounts."
The Canadian Driver piece is not entirely accurate in its declaration of toque split and torque shift in a Torsen equipped set up such as the A4. The new A4 could actually send 2/3 of the power of the engine to the front left or the rear right for that matter. The most the Infiniti system can do is send 50% forward -- not that that should ever be insufficient. The Torsen system simply can send another 17% forward should it be necessary to do so.