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Hybrid Vehicles Hybrid Vehicles - Archived Discussions What type of hybrid should I buy? 
453 messages, Last post on Aug 19, 2005 at 6:05 PM
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usbseawolf2000 "Honda Accord Hybrid vs. Toyota Camry Hybrid" Apr 17, 2004 6:08pm Dennis |
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| I just got back from Iceland and while I was there I dropped in at a Toyota dealer. They had a 2004 Prius on display but weren't selling any till May. The car comes with a lot more equipment that Toyota offers in the US, such as a height adjustable drivers seat, rear fog lights, a backup sensor that tells you when you get to close to the car behind you when you are backing into a parking space, an EV switch which allows you to drive in electric mode up to 45 KPH and the side curtain bags all as standard. They expect to sell a lot of them. Gas in Iceland is about $4.00 plus a gallon and they do drive fuel efficient cars. They think the Prius will fit into the mix very well. The price is a lot more than in the US so if you are thinking of buying a Prius it could be a good deal and possibly a good investment. Maybe Toyota will offer some of the extras in the 2005. | |
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in the U.S. standard Prius content is dictated solely by three things: price point, price point, price point. It was vitally important for them in a PR sort of way to make the car exactly $20 grand again, same as the last model. And so it is, at least before the $6000 option packages...I wonder if they will ever offer moonroofs on hybrid-equipped models...
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Replying to: nippononly (Apr 19, 2004 1:59 pm) If price point is the only criteria then it seems an economical ; decontented Prius would have been offered. When you get to the 20K range as a starting point and have 7K worth of options you have lots and lots of competiton price-wise and non of it is other economy ( high miles per gallon) cars. Toyota lost money on the classic Prius and makes very little on the current Prius. It more like one of those loss leaders in a store to bring you into the store thinking that if this one items is such a good deal( In this case environmentally conscience , high mileage and high technology, yet economy- cloth seats, no sunroof, minimally adjustable seat) then the whole Toyota line must follow the same ideals and standards. The you walk away with a Sequoia (14 city/17 highway) becauae you thought you needed the size and space. And best of all the dealership made enouugh profit to sell another loss-leader Prius. Cheers and good-day YMMV MidCow |
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what you perhaps don't realize: "If price point is the only criteria then it seems an economical ; decontented Prius would have been offered." is that the $20K Prius IS the economical decontented version, which is why package 9 costs almost $6000 and puts back in stuff that is already standard on the $20K Camry (plus adding other stuff). Those hybrid guts cost enough to have to make deep cuts to bring the car to $20K for base price. The NAV and Smart Entry you mention are not standard. But the 2004 is definitely a better value than the "classic" Prius if only for its much larger passenger and cargo capacity. |
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Toyota lost money on the classic Prius and makes very little on the current Prius. This is not true. The fact that the classic Prius was a money-maker during the latter stages of its life has been well documented in the press. And how much is "very little"? This was said of the Prius by some posters even before Toyota raised the base price by $300. So take what the profit was before and add $300. Is that still "very little"? Any profit on a car in its first year of a redesign is pretty good IMO--there's the development and tooling costs to recoup. Also, it is common in the auto industry for automakers to offer smaller, fuel-efficient cars to draw buyers into dealerships and to keep up their CAFE scores. Today's Prius buyer could be tomorrow's RX400h or Sienna hybrid buyer. |
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| I just don't believe Toyota when they say they make money on the Prius. | |
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| criminal for them to lie about it? I mean, they have a board of stockholders to account to just like any other corporation... | |
| ...it's only criminal if they lie about the profits of the corporation in general (or it's individual companies), not about an individual product line. Also, it's pretty easy to play games with numbers in order to make a statement that, while not exactly a lie, isn't in the same ballpark as the truth either. | |
| using accounting as a strategic tool. There are at least two sets of books Toyota has to report on. One is reported profit and the other is actual expenses. If you write off future gains from current expenses and discount government subsidies it can make the profit look much better to the public and the press. Sometimes the government might allow you to claim all the R&D as a tax write off. It is hard to say how a hybrid could be produced with much more expensive parts and still make a profit if on the same line you are making conventional cars, using the same assembly methods and those cars are only making a small profit because of volume. That isn't lying, as pointed out, because you only have to show net profit to the corporations board, not even the stock holders get all the information. | |
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