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Hybrid Vehicles Toyota Highlander Hybrid Toyota Highlander Hybrid
3943 messages, Last post on Nov 02, 2009 at 9:19 AM
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Replying to: cdptrap (May 29, 2008 9:34 pm) But then the statement continues.."too much yaw (rotation around the car's centre of gravity)" By this extended definition of "too much yaw" the only difference between VDIM and VSC becomes the addition of the variable stearing ratio coupling and its integration into the "mix". So, apparently, the VDIM system remains REACTIVE just as was/is VSC. I suspect the real difference is that the VDIM/VSC intervention is now much more noticeable by the driver due to the sudden change in stearing ratio, resistance to stearing in the "wrong" direction.
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Replying to: wwest (May 29, 2008 10:34 am) RSC, Rollover stability control. This steps in when there is risk of the SUV rolling over, which is the greatest risk for an SUV. I personally am not a fan of VSC; I prefer to manage my own turns. Of course, I'm a VERY careful driver, and my care increases as the temperature decreases.
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Replying to: stevedebi (May 30, 2008 9:57 am) The PSM in my Porsche is the ideal system IMMHO in that it waits a few hundred milliseconds to give me time to react and if I react in the correct manner, say turn inside the skid, it remains inactive. |
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Replying to: wwest (May 30, 2008 9:36 am) This is another link from Toyota that shows how VDIM does a bit more than VSC. http://www.toyota.co.jp/en/safety_presen/tech/33.html As for whether it is "proactive", I think we are actually saying the same thing but emphasizing different aspects. It is true that the VDIM must first detect the possibility of an event before taking action, so one can say it is reactive in that regard. It is also true that the VDIM can, within reason, detect an event and take corrective action even before a driver realizes something is amiss, so one can also say it is proactive in that regard. It is easier to emphasize the latter because we have experienced it. We were in a traffic jam crawling at about 30+ MPH and I simply turned the steering hard to left and pressed on the gas pedal hoping to dart-merge into a carpool lane, something I had done thousands of times in all other cars, the VDIM stopped me cold. The car would not accelerate, the steering became heavy and the turn wouldn't happen. There was 0%-risk of roll-over but the VDIM resisted the turn. If the car had turned and accelerated and then the VDIM kicked in, I would wholeheartedly agree it was reacting. In our case, the VDIM simply refused to do it. We have since learned to just turn only as much as needed and smoothly press down on the gas. The smooth movement does as much as a dart-merge but a lot safer. So in everyday driving activities, as far as a driver is concerned, the VDIM is relatively proactive. So much so that many drivers (Lexus drivers and Canadian Driver testers) call it a "nanny" or "big brother" system and ask for ways to turn it off!  We decided to leave it on because as long as it makes my drive safe and comfy, I am happy. Cheers!
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Replying to: cdptrap (May 30, 2008 1:51 pm) Apparently I gave the Toyota engineers who designed these systems too much credit. I'm pretty sure the first instance of a form of VSC was on a european marque, MB or BMW, and those systems, ABS/TC/"VSC", were totally integrated from the get go. If I am reading the information in that last link correctly then Toyota has only recently realized that absent integration, FULL integration, these systems could/might interfer with each other in a negative way. I don't now know if this is still of importance but in my '01 AWD RX300 if I floor the accelerate while trying to make a really tight accelerating turn the engine goes "flat" and will not recover until I release and then reapply the accelerator a bit more slowly or lightly. And yes, these sensors can be used to detect an "out-of-whack" driving condition substantially sooner than the best and more experienced driver might using our "seat-of-the-pants" sensing capability.
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Rather than turn off any functionality of VDIM I wonder if it might not be a better solution for the VDIM to have a "sub-mode" wherein the automatic intervention is delayed like Porsche does with PSM. On the track at Daytona a few years ago I left mine on but insofar as I could tell I was always quick enough with my own corrective response that it never activated. So, if a driver feels like "pushing the envelope" a bit go to the sub-mode, otherwise.... |
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Replying to: wwest (May 30, 2008 2:35 pm) People research the '08 HH because it is a hybrid SUV with the potential to get excellent MPG ( better than my '06 HH ) so if someone wants to know what they are getting for $50K, it is fair to remind them of the VDIM in addition to the HSD. So in addition to saving gas, they are getting a new Toyota safety system previously only available in Lexus. Then it is up to that person to decide whether VDIM is worth the extras. For people researching VDIM ( as I once did ), and for new owners of HH, it is much more important to know what it is in practice, what can one expect driving with it, why is it different from Toyota VSC, what benefits does it offer, what problems does it have, how does it impact our driving experience either negatively or positively. Such info help people make intelligent decision. I have enjoyed learning from your posts so this is not to claim "Toyota is best". I am only loyal to a good product that meets my needs regardless of brand . If GM comes out with something that best the HH tomorrow, it will have my undivided attention. I am also an engineer who works in mission critical systems so getting things right, whether we like them or not, is in my "genes", so to speak. Thus my interest in making sure the differences between Toyota VSC and Toyota VDIM are clearly stated. The rest is up to the readers. Cheers! |
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Not sure if I made a mistake but a post disappeared probably because I provided links to a competing forum. For those researching VDIM and want to read other people's impression, please use the search-string "VDIM vs VSC" in Google. Look for Lexus club and AutoByTel test discussions. Canadian Driver also ran a test in 2006 using the '06 HH. They also provided their view of the VDIM. Popular Mechanics also did a test and provided a video clip of a '06 HH doing a slalom. The Canadian report reads "toyota highlander" but it is the Highlander hybrid because of the telltale air intake slot in the front bumper and the wheel design. Popular Mechanic's video clip ( the HH they used looked to have the squishy Integrity tires ): http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive/new_cars/1829251.html Hope that helps. |
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Replying to: cdptrap (May 29, 2008 9:34 pm) perhaps Toyota dealers could inform their customers of the above, at least after the sale was made. The dealers could show Toyota Highlander customers the features of this Hybrid, for example how to drive for improved gas mileage in a hybrid, emergency handling procedures or how the VDIM works . . . features that differ from other vehicles. instead my dealer spent time trying to sell me an extended warranty (no, I found a lower price on at another Toyota dealer's web site), and additional rusting proofing (again, no) and other features I did not want - time spent to try to get additional $$ from me, but no time spent on how VDIM works.  I figured out myself. I like the VDIM feature, too. End
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