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Hybrid Vehicles Toyota Prius Toyota Prius
7481 messages, Last post on Dec 01, 2009 at 7:44 AM
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Replying to: kneisl1 (Jul 03, 2006 2:13 am) Far more people understand what a "full" hybrid is than you think, seeing right past your attempt to mislead. The hydraulic hybrid system is a low-end "assist" design, so its abilities are quite limited. For a purpose like UPS is testing, that could translate to a definite benefit. But what if you require A/C in that traffic with frequent stops? You're basically screwed. The engine must be run for that hydraulic-equipped system to keep you cool. In a "full" hybrid, that isn't the case since the A/C can be entirely electric. And what about cruising, how long do you actually believe the hydraulic pressure will last? The "full" hybrid persistently recharges, so there is always an ample supply of electricity available. That allows the electric motor to be taken advantage of, even when on the highway. When will the hydraulic pressure be recovered and when/how can it be used? JOHN |
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"I see you find it acceptable to pay money to big oil companies....and to large corporations such as Toyota." Actually I dont pay any great sum of money to anyone. Thats because I own a Toyota ECHO. (just paid $13 in fuel expences to drive it for 21 days) HA! "...your attempt to mislead" No I was trying to IMFORM not mislead. The Toyota Prius is not the only way to conserve. IMHO opinion the ECHO is by far the best bet out there. While the Prius saves gas (mostly in local traffic) it also gives your money to Toyota instead of the oil companies. How much better if 75% of our vehicles were like ECHOs? We wouldnt need $25,000 Prius's and the denand for gasoline would be what, half of what it is now? The price of oil would DROP! A cheap, simple, and highly effective solution. Thats not misleading either.
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Replying to: kneisl1 (Jul 03, 2006 8:09 am) The "small car, cheap oil" situation you just described already happened. Don't you remember that? It is how we got in this mess we are struggling with now. Let's not fall for the same cyclical trap again. The 80's brought a flood of small cars. They were pretty efficient compared to the norm, very much like the suggestion you just made. The price of oil went down. It stayed low. Automakers ended up taking advantage of that. The solution to the small profit the small vehicles provided was to increase the size. Consumers didn't complain. After all, the price of gas was cheap. The size continued to grow. It got out of hand... causing the very situation we are in now. The re-emergence of small cars is starting that same cycle all over again. Fortunately, some of us are aware enough to have noticed the pattern and the reality that efficiency alone is not a true solution. With hybrids brings reduced smog-related emissions too. That is not a selling feature of the small cars, which focus only on higher MPG. The desire for a larger vehicle will compel people to abandon small cars after awhile anyway. Hybrid technology does require modest price increase, but with it you can continue to drive the bigger sedans and large minivans since they'll deliver greater efficiency and lower emissions. Isn't that the point? JOHN
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Replying to: kneisl1 (Jul 03, 2006 8:09 am) Then I suggest addressing the differences between "assist" and "full" hybrid. Your hydraulic comments did not, but should have since hybrid type was the topic. JOHN |
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| The authorities are allowing the market place to dictate our approach to the high cost of energy. I cant argue with that. What price we will pay remains to be seen. I have always owned the most economical car I could buy. Americans wouldnt have bought a hybrid in 1980 either. For that matter, a 1980 VW Rabbit Diesel wasnt worth its $7500 price tag either. | |
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Replying to: kneisl1 (Jul 03, 2006 8:09 am) Your position would have everyone no matter their circumstances, budget, preferences buy only an econobox or bicycle. In theory this is the best solution for reducing/eliminating pollution. It's a utopian view that has been proven not to work in any modern society. It will not work in a capitalistic free market society. There is no one solution ( best solution ) for everyone. Your solution is actually only good for your particular situation, desires and needs.
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Heres how I look at it. The price of energy has to where to go but UP. This is especially true now that China is beginning to use energy on the same scale as the US. At the same time our energy use shows absolutely NO sign of even leveling off. Its just increasing all the time. How would you like to see $10 a gallon gasoline? Could you afford to drive even a 20 mpg vehicle then? Thats not the only issue. Theres global warming. I dont know if it driven by the CO2 levels or its just happening naturally. It just seems only prudent to produce as little CO2 as possible. Certainly the CO2 levels have nowhere to go but UP in the future. The US will have 300 million citizens soon. How long till 1 billion? Ten years? Twentyfive? Just exactly how much CO2 can we produce before something really bad happens to our climate? I dont know. Maybe it doesnt matter. Maybe the consequences are worse than we can imagine. What Im afraid is going to happen is we're going to price ourselves right out of ANY kind of personal transportation vehicle. If everyone is riding the bus to work/vacation/the store, an ECHO begines to look pretty good! Could it happen?
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Replying to: kneisl1 (Jul 03, 2006 2:18 pm) Things never stand still it's just not our way as human beings. There is a need and a demand as displayed by the acceptance of the hybrids during the last 3 yrs for very efficient vehicles. Businesses will look for ways to satisfy our demand because it will be profitable business. We as consumers can choose between several options one of which might be a relatively efficient Echo or Yaris or Fit or Versa. Or it might be a diesel dual mode truck that saves more fuel than any Echo might. Consider that if a 30 mpg truck would replace a 16 mpg truck it would be like your Echo getting 70 mpg. Consider that the Echo, Civic, Versa, et.al. are the 'base line' and that all future vehicles that are sold after 2010 for example have to get 35 mpg on average or if not then show a 50% fuel saving from the prior model. Now we'd be saving a lot of money/fuel/resources and improving the environment. Count on businesses to find some way to profit off this, it's part of our market-based Capitalism.
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Jul 03, 2006 11:45 am) too much time in the car is the most important to me.
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Replying to: kdhspyder (Jul 03, 2006 2:29 pm) That makes if very convenient for Ford & GM. They are getting an adjustment on their PU trucks to 33 MPG EPA rating for making them flex fuel E85 ready. Kind of a double whammy. Those with the FFV will get the bye on higher mileage. Thanks to the deep pockets of the Mega Ag executives. Who are probably on the boards of Ford, GM & Exxon. Why build a hybrid when you can add a couple bucks worth of stainless steel to prevent ethanol corrosion. |
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